Pushed to quit after 1,860 days subbed

[Claviusnex]

I have a house, and while I knew about the demo timer in general, I didn't realize there was a place to check in-game for it. So this morning I thought I'd check it out once I was done patching, and this is all I see:


This isn't exactly helpful. Up until Raskbuck's post above, I didn't realize it would remain blank until 15 days or less until demo. This would probably be a fantastic spot to put some quick information regarding the demolition / item reclamation time frame, as well as maybe an active timer or some other notice.

Yep there are some other threads about having the timer show all of the time and go red at 15 days. Even that gets push back about responsibility, it won't help me and not wanting UI changes even though it is already there. I just don't get why so many folks in the player base jump all over suggestions that only provide more information and don't affect them one iota.

[Alleo]

But just because SE does not do something now does not mean they will never do it in the future at all. Its just strange to see people argue against it even when it would not even hurt them. You say that you dont find it acceptable yet argued quite a bit on how its kinda our fault because information outside the game exists. So if you are not fine with the situation why even argue against it at all?

SE probably not doing something is imo not a good reason to say that people should not discuss it or want it (not directly meant at you btw) or even be against a better solution. Maybe they wont change something but the OP was told by a GM to post their opinion and maybe just maybe there is a little hope that it will reach their ear and if not then we have at least done everything we could do.

[ko_]

But just because SE does not do something now does not mean they will never do it in the future at all. Its just strange to see people argue against it even when it would not even hurt them. You say that you dont find it acceptable yet argued quite a bit on how its kinda our fault because information outside the game exists. So if you are not fine with the situation why even argue against it at all?

SE probably not doing something is imo not a good reason to say that people should not discuss it or want it (not directly meant at you btw) or even be against a better solution. Maybe they wont change something but the OP was told by a GM to post their opinion and maybe just maybe there is a little hope that it will reach their ear and if not then we have at least done everything we could do.

I mean in the OP case it is his fault. This is entirely his fault. He's is not blameless in this case at all. I'm not saying SE is blameless but I'm sick of people throwing AL kinds of care away cause - SE is evil and I'm mad so they ruined EVERYTHING- thought process. At some point we as players HAVE to own up to our own mistakes. And this is one of those cases where OP is at fault. And YES it's cause the imformation IS out there. IT DOES exist and because it does and he's the only person in this thread and maybe the whole game who didn't know about demo timeers when he's been playing for over a 1000 DAYS? THAT is what I was debating cause it doesn't make sense. And no amount of telling me his excuses will make it make sense. See myt sonic example on why. But thats why I keptt saying JUST cause I believe SE needs better systems does NOT mean I blieve op is not at fault cause he IS. Even with everything in place.. all he had to do was google. And until SE changes something yes you going to be expected to go out of game to get your info otherwise shame on you.

[Skivvy]

I mean in the OP case it is his fault. This is entirely his fault. He's is not blameless in this case at all. I'm not saying SE is blameless but I'm sick of people throwing AL kinds of care away cause - SE is evil and I'm mad so they ruined EVERYTHING- thought process. At some point we as players HAVE to own up to our own mistakes. And this is one of those cases where OP is at fault. And YES it's cause the imformation IS out there. IT DOES exist and because it does and he's the only person in this thread and maybe the whole game who didn't know about demo timeers when he's been playing for over a 1000 DAYS? THAT is what I was debating cause it doesn't make sense. And no amount of telling me his excuses will make it make sense. See myt sonic example on why. But thats why I keptt saying JUST cause I believe SE needs better systems does NOT mean I blieve op is not at fault cause he IS. Even with everything in place.. all he had to do was google. And until SE changes something yes you going to be expected to go out of game to get your info otherwise shame on you.

When we play this game, we do not sign a waiver stating that we will search out all producer notes, live letters, patch notes, etc. It is not the responsibility of a player to actively search for information outside of the game that they play. If the game is not providing sufficient information in-game, that is a failing of the developers.

Yes, of course you can learn far more by doing outside research, but the fact of the matter is that it is not a requirement to play this game. SE's inability to properly warn players in-game of the demolition / reclamation process is entirely on their hands. This is the only content that you can lose permanently, and they do a horrible job of letting you know that. Did you see that screenshot I posted above? If I somehow did not know about the demolition process, what exactly am I going to learn from that screen?

This thread, if nothing else, will hopefully open SE's eyes to the fact that they need to improve on this particular issue. As others have mentioned, they have obnoxious pop-ups for far less important things (e.g. achievements, which you can't even hide..). There is really no excuse for them to not be more diligent on the housing notifications.

[ko_]

When we play this game, we do not sign a waiver stating that we will search out all producer notes, live letters, patch notes, etc. It is not the responsibility of a player to actively search for information outside of the game that they play. If the game is not providing sufficient information in-game, that is a failing of the developers.

Yes, of course you can learn far more by doing outside research, but the fact of the matter is that it is not a requirement to play this game. SE's inability to properly warn players in-game of the demolition / reclamation process is entirely on their hands. This is the only content that you can lose permanently, and they do a horrible job of letting you know that. Did you see that screenshot I posted above? If I somehow did not know about the demolition process, what exactly am I going to learn from that screen?

This thread, if nothing else, will hopefully open SE's eyes to the fact that they need to improve on this particular issue. As others have mentioned, they have obnoxious pop-ups for far less important things (e.g. achievements, which you can't even hide..). There is really no excuse for them to not be more diligent on the housing notifications.

Go into a raid with that logic, play black mage with that logic.. do anything else outside of housing with that logic want watch what happens. And no I don't mean on day 1. I mean when you have over 1000 plus days on whatever it is and telling peoople that. See where that gets you. See how people let you their groups with open arms and s. I'll wait. :/ You see whats wrong here? SE can do a million things and none of it changes what happened. Stop defending someone being lazy. He has well over A THOUSAND playing hours. In an mmo, you mean to tell me he's innoccent for NOT doing ANY kind of research? How in the world did he miss ALL the info being mentioned about the timers. IN FOUR POINT TWO????!!!?! SERIOUSLY? I dunno.. Sorry but I'mma have to agree to disagree here. there's nothing you can tell me to change my mind.. OP is def at fault here. I already said SE needs better stuff but THAT doesn't mean OP isn't at fault for NOT paying attention. Sorry.

[Skivvy]

Go into a raid with that logic, play black mage with that logic.. do anything else outside of housing with that logic want watch what happens. And no I don't mean on day 1. I mean when you have over 1000 plus days on whatever it is and telling peoople that. See where that gets you. See how people let you their groups with open arms and s. I'll wait. :/ You see whats wrong here? SE can do a million things and none of it changes what happened. Stop defending someone being lazy. He has well over A THOUSAND playing hours. In an mmo, you mean to tell me he's innoccent for NOT doing ANY kind of research? How in the world did he miss ALL the info being mentioned about the timers. IN FOUR POINT TWO????!!!?! SERIOUSLY? I dunno.. Sorry but I'mma have to agree to disagree here. there's nothing you can tell me to change my mind.. OP is def at fault here. I already said SE needs better stuff but THAT doesn't mean OP isn't at fault for NOT paying attention. Sorry.

You can absolutely do raiding without any outside research. You have your tooltips. You can slowly get through it with trial and error. How do you think people that get World Firsts manage? There are no guides for new content, and yet they manage to clear it. So that argument doesn't work at all.

Also, OP has already said several times they are not blaming SE. They are trying to bring awareness and share their thoughts as the GM suggested.

[ko_]

You can absolutely do raiding without any outside research. You have your tooltips. You can slowly get through it with trial and error. How do you think people that get World Firsts manage? There are no guides for new content, and yet they manage to clear it. So that argument doesn't work at all.

Also, OP has already said several times they are not blaming SE. They are trying to bring awareness and share their thoughts as the GM suggested.

I said NOT on day 1 tho. You missed that part. You also missed the part where I said go into a raid talking like you have over 1000 days played NEVER looking at guides and whatnot. You would not be accepted. And EVERYONE i nthat group is going to tell you to read a guide etc etc. Again want proof.. - tales of a dutyfinder - My point being is pointing at SE for a user error is messed up and is the sole reason we can never have anything with teeth cause everyone cries like a baby cause - the game didn't hold my hand- When it shouldn't. You should know enough about games that - sonic doesn't play like mario or crash.- Why? Cause just because one mmo didn't kill your house with a timer does NOT mean they ALL follow the same rules. If you can't find it ingame, ask someone , if they don't know - which EVERYONE knew here- then google it. There was NO excuse for him to NOT know about any of those timers. NOT when people blew up about it like a year ago, and even more before that. Housing has been a HUGE topic in this game since I've been here for what... 2 years and a half years. EVERYONE was talking about it. If you have enough sense to come to the freaking fourms then what is your excuse for not knowing? The info is THERE. Look for it.

No but he pointed his finger at SE which ofcourse people will bandwagon and blame SE when this entire thing is becuase of HIS user error. The onkly point I was and have been making this entire time was if he just had enough sense to google. He'll have his stuff, he'll have everything. Just because you're not told to go outside the game to look things up doesn't mean you SHOULDN'T. Will won't hear anyone say this about anything else in the game.. so why treat this one different... you don't. So if you choose to NOT go outside and learn then what happens to you is your fault cause the info is def out there. SE doesn't need to baby us all the time.

[Penthea]

Go into a raid with that logic, play black mage with that logic.. do anything else outside of housing with that logic want watch what happens. And no I don't mean on day 1. I mean when you have over 1000 plus days on whatever it is and telling peoople that. See where that gets you.

I know a great blm who doesn't read guides for his class or boss tactics and he does purple parses. He learns the fights himself along with his static and they coordinate together on how to make the most of their team's dps. I know of quite a few statics and only one among them has reading guides as a requirement. And no the progress doesn't differ greatly from the one who read guides to those who go in blind.

Contrary to what you might think reading guides isn't a requirement for raiding. The -players- might tell you it's a requirement, but that's a person demanding this. Not the game. Plenty of people raid blind and learn from their own experience instead of second-hand experience from others. It's actually pretty common.

As for the rest of the game you don't need guides at all. I don't know what way you play and if whatever you do works for you, then great. But personally myself and nearly everyone else I know rarely look up guides unless something genuinely confuses us.

Heck the only reason why I looked up a guide for housing years ago was because I wanted to find out if there was a mechanic in the game that added more wards. Had there been an empty plot for me to buy then I wouldn't have bothered looking up a guide. I'd have just bought the plot and learned as I explored the content myself. Which is actually how most players approach content in general.

[ko_]

I know a great blm who doesn't read guides for his class or boss tactics and he does purple parses. He learns the fights himself along with his static and they coordinate together on how to make the most of their team's dps. I know of quite a few statics and only one among them has reading guides as a requirement. And no the progress doesn't differ greatly from the one who read guides to those who go in blind.

Contrary to what you might think reading guides isn't a requirement for raiding. The -players- might tell you it's a requirement, but that's a person demanding this. Not the game. Plenty of people raid blind and learn from their own experience instead of second-hand experience from others. It's actually pretty common.

As for the rest of the game you don't need guides at all. I don't know what way you play and if whatever you do works for you, then great. But personally myself and nearly everyone else I know rarely look up guides unless something genuinely confuses us.

Heck the only reason why I looked up a guide for housing years ago was because I wanted to find out if there was a mechanic in the game that added more wards. Had there been an empty plot for me to buy then I wouldn't have bothered looking up a guide. I'd have just bought the plot and learned as I explored the content myself. Which is actually how most players approach content in general.

Funny thing in your try to debunk me.. you proved my point. When something confused you did what now? OH YOU DID WHAT I MENTIONED OP SHOULD DO HOW ABOUT THAT??? So OP couldn't do that? You did it, TONS of people have, tons of people do. This isn't about raiding. That was just an example. But you already proved my point. The fact OP didn't do that is WHY I continue to say it's his fault for losing his stuff. If he was some noob kid then that'll be one thing. But he put in the title he has over 1000 days...... and started on day one. I'm sorry... you should've known better.

[Penthea]

Funny thing in your try to debunk me.. you proved my point. When something confused you did what now? OH YOU DID WHAT I MENTIONED OP SHOULD DO HOW ABOUT THAT??? So OP couldn't do that?

Did you even read OP's post? He found out there were things about housing he didn't know after he lost his house. He wasn't confused until after his house and furnishings were gone.