9/15 LuckyBancho Census (with UwU numbers)

[Vaer]

Didnt Yoshida also state in that one interview that the JP playerbase have a different view on content? Like if its there they want to clear it thus more people might try to clear raids unlike people in NA and EU. This could also be the reason why they did not give people a third Ultimate. Maybe too many JP players are still trying to clear the other two so that they did not need a third one? But that is pure speculation on my side.

I get the feeling that we western players just simply do the content that we like and not force ourselves to do savage content just to have everything done.

I believe Yoshi said that they view content as "if it's there, we need to do it." Over here it ends up as either wanting to do hard content for personal reasons or not doing it because it isn't efficient/too much effort for the reward considering other avenues of getting comparable gear.

Anyways, they are just way more organized than we are. They usually settle into universal strats that aren't hard to reproduce no matter the comp as long as a minimum player skill threshold is met. Just remember over here we had Tsuku with so many different meteor strats it was a pain sorting that out than it should have been in pugs. Even with Kefka we had the line strat and box strat, edge celestriad and cross celestriad, or Guardian with vertical/horizontal virus, CW/CCW library and different ways of dealing with Ultros + missiles.

[JackHatchet]

As someone who pays a sub for both games. I mainly play FFXIV for the community/RP stuff (hence the Mateus server), so my progression on FFXIV is not as good. I don't look for a FFXIV guild for raiding progression. Nor will I waste my weekend pugging and learning FFXIV raids if they're just pugs.

FFXIV is also unique in that you can get max ilvl gear 370 without raiding. You can go mendacity/lighthouse coins. Which means that if you think critically about it a bit. One can reckon that learning/grinding harder raid content is more time consuming than just doing your mendacity dailies ect. Again, think critically about it. What's the goal of players? Do people raid because they want to raid, or do some raid because they just want the best gear? If people are smart enough and figure they can get the best gear from capping mendacity--why bash your head on a wall with pugs?

I raid in Warcraft, because FFXIV's server-tic drives me insane. I play things that I enjoy, because I play games for fun. Not to grind or stress myself out, or out of some misguided social pressure to do so, or be a teamplayer or whatever. I play the content I enjoy--and I avoid content I don't like. FFXIV raiding feels crappy compared to WoWs, and it's mostly because of the combat tic. If they fixed that--I'd enjoy FFXIV raiding a lot more. I also hate that FFXIV raiding is 4 bosses per 6 months. Not very fun socially. And once you clear it--then what?

[Aerlana]

I also hate that FFXIV raiding is 4 bosses per 6 months. Not very fun socially. And once you clear it--then what?

I did "serious" raid on both game (trying to kill twintania/nael/bahamut before the end of weekly lock, manage each time / trying to be serv first on wow) . I did learn to play with the server-tic. So i wont fully agree with your post. I have other complains. But all these are also feeling question i think.

Just want to answer for the part i did quote. I am today an "anti-FFXIV". the game could have been so much and... here we have. like you i log in FF mainly for RP now (doing some PvE content here and there, but not sadic, rarely extrem primals).
WoW in legion (last expansion) it is 40 raid bosses. FFXIV, we could count 33 bosses = 7 primals (2 at X.0, 5 with .X patches + 12 from raid 24 and 12 from raid 8 and the 2 ultimate we had... lets hope a third? :x).
31 is less than 40. But a far better number.
When i came in ARR, while WoW did add the "LFR" difficulty (so LFR < normal < heroic) i did have a bad view of this, and SoO was not to help (another difficulty between LFR and "normal"). But finally. Cant find a game that doest more than 20 boss hard (Mythic/sadic difficulty at least) all different, and have other (fully others) for more casual player (and then, LFR for really low player ^^")


FFXIV itself had a matter. Casual did complain about not able to see in game the bahamut's cinematics. A complain i did understand. And the solution was? story mode. only matter with it in my mind : it should open 2 weeks AFTER sadic (LFR in WoW, the "story mode" opens 1 week later but with only 3 bosses from a raid that can go to 10+ bosses).


Maybe Yoshida should consider making the raid24 source of "end game" content for community. The best thing would be more boss mooooooar. but even if i have many to say against the game today, i dont want to ask the moon. For rathalos, normal mode = 8 players, extrem mode 4 player.

Why not see raid 24 bosses a "sadic" mode for 8 players with similar difficulties than sadic? I would prefer difficulty with 24 players (because i also like where there is many people to coordinate with... 8 is short in my mind) But yoshida said he didnt want it and i can understand.

With his we could go from 4 to 8 boss per cycle. to 24 bosses during an expansion (1 per month) + 2 for top guild (3? please yoshida, give us 3 ultimate per expansion é_è )
Then why not adding same thing for primals? adding 3 bosses for the raid tier, and then 2 of the others.

[whiskeybravo]

As someone who pays a sub for both games. I mainly play FFXIV for the community/RP stuff (hence the Mateus server), so my progression on FFXIV is not as good. I don't look for a FFXIV guild for raiding progression. Nor will I waste my weekend pugging and learning FFXIV raids if they're just pugs.

FFXIV is also unique in that you can get max ilvl gear 370 without raiding. You can go mendacity/lighthouse coins. Which means that if you think critically about it a bit. One can reckon that learning/grinding harder raid content is more time consuming than just doing your mendacity dailies ect. Again, think critically about it. What's the goal of players? Do people raid because they want to raid, or do some raid because they just want the best gear? If people are smart enough and figure they can get the best gear from capping mendacity--why bash your head on a wall with pugs?

I raid in Warcraft, because FFXIV's server-tic drives me insane. I play things that I enjoy, because I play games for fun. Not to grind or stress myself out, or out of some misguided social pressure to do so, or be a teamplayer or whatever. I play the content I enjoy--and I avoid content I don't like. FFXIV raiding feels crappy compared to WoWs, and it's mostly because of the combat tic. If they fixed that--I'd enjoy FFXIV raiding a lot more. I also hate that FFXIV raiding is 4 bosses per 6 months. Not very fun socially. And once you clear it--then what?

You can only get the highest item level gear after raids have been unlocked. For 4 months or so it's exclusively for the raiders. In that respect, yes it is much much faster to get gear via raiding if your group can manage to kill stuff within that 4-5 month time gap. And usually the best gear is a combination of tome and raid gear, so it's not like you need all of one set or the other, hence you can gear up faster by going for both at the same time. I don't think any serious raider is going to forego capping tomes (especially in the early weeks/months) just because they are raiding. Not how it works, you're doing both.

Everyone's goal for raiding is different. If I had to guess I'd say most do it for the gear, some for the glory. For me, it's about the only thing I enjoy doing in this game any more. Everything else feels like a chore. Being a tank only half the gear is valuable to me (sad lol), so it's more about just the challenge itself and enjoying the people I raid with.

What do you do once you clear it? Clear it again. And again. Until everyone get's their chest and weapon. Then go for oranges. Oranges are healthy for you

[JackHatchet]

I cut my teeth on competitive raiding back in Wrath/early Cata. I chased the glory of seeing how far I could push it. How far we could go as a team. It was a lot of fun, and I think any serious raider should challenge themselves to the point where they're in a team of equal-minded players--and they literally can't push any further. For me, it was a dream that I reached. And after making it--it was a great ego boost for a long time. Being able to lord realm firsts and national ranks. But looking back at it. As anyone reading this post. No matter what we do. No matter how hard we push ourselves--those accomplishments result in diddly squat. No one would care if I was part of the world first team to kill 4H--and they shouldn't. In the end--raiding is just about personal gratification and playing with people you enjoy--because the prestige of it--it's fleeting.

It's why I don't care about Ultimate, because busting my balls for 2-3 weeks to master some complex fight wouldn't mean anything in a few months or a year. And would ultimately feel like 2 weeks of wasted time. Although, I do think anyone who 'hasn't peaked' should certainly push themselves to their peak--that life experience is worth it. Whether it be raiding, or mountain climbing, or even running a marathon. Being able to push yourself. Your body and your spirit to the edge--that's an experience worth having on one's bucket list.

---

Anyways, I meant this as a response to the "you don't get the highest item level unless you wait months." Yeah, big deal. You only need the best gear to run raids. Gear is just a crutch to accomplish something. A means to an end. Though some people look at gear as the end-game. And being able to max 370 without raiding means that a lot of people--don't need to raid. And those non-raiders don't give two thoughts about BiS. I doubt they even know their stat weights. They just know that bigger numbers are better. It's not like anything inside the game-world itself will ever convey that spell-speed has a different value ratio to direct hit. They just see that 370 is better than 360.

The point is that a lot of people. Most people... they're looking for a finish line. Some of them use MSQ as that line. Some use 370 gear. Others just float around and do things willy-nilly. So a lot of people crave a full 370 set. Even if they never raid. Even if they never use the gear to its full potential. Even if it takes them months longer. They don't care. Because eventually--time is the great equalizer. We'll all sit here on a patch-ull sitting in 370. The ultima raiders. The midcore crusaders, and the casual who just plays on the weekend. We all end in the same position. In a full set of 370 gear just waiting for the next treadmill race to begin--and then do it all over again.

As for me. I'll gear up just enough to not be a liability in a raid, but I won't do anything I don't enjoy to accomplish it. Which means I generally end up in a full set of crafted gear. But I don't run Primals beyond the one time for the experience. I don't care about mounts. I have my one favorite mount ever (the cloud), and anything else is a complete waste of my time (unless I enjoy the content itself). I even follow this philosophy in Warcraft. Games are meant to be fun, so I play them as I enjoy them. I refuse to subjugate myself to stupid grinds like Azerite power or Eureka. I found myself a fun and friendly WoW raiding guild that I enjoy with a casual item level. My item level will go up in time. I have MONTHS to enjoy Uldir--so why burn out on the first two weeks? IT's not a race. There's no reward for winning except self gratification--and many of us have already tasted that victory.

[JackHatchet]

Eureka taught me that I shouldn't invest time into a game that I don't enjoy. That I had convinced myself to capping out on mendacity to gear up was fun--it's just tolerable. So after taking a long look at why I played FFXIV. I cut out a lot of the fat, and all the extra time pulled me back into Warcraft. Where by playing both games stupidly casually--I can experience all the aspects I enjoy--without being burned out on the content I hate.

No Eureka
No crappy world quests (I do a few I enjoy, but skip ones I don't)
No trials that only reward mounts and sub-par weapons
No island expeditions.

Just me and my crafting playing the market board in FFXIV while raiding in Warcraft. My biggest salt issue is that neither game is perfect, and I wish one of them was obviously better than the other so I could quit one. But they're both incredibly flawed. And everytime I think FFXIV might have an edge over Warcraft--they squander that potential in a way only Square-Enix can. 1.0, Diadem, Eureka, Squadrons, glamour wardrobe, the companion app, PvP, and more.

I mean seriously Square-Enix, you're so close to being such a good game, but you manage to take any good idea and do it half-arsed enough to make it annoying. I'm seriously just waiting for you guys to announce the bunny race to public fan-fare just to disappoint us all over again by saying they're gender-locked.

[TwistedTea]

The point is that a lot of people. Most people... they're looking for a finish line. Some of them use MSQ as that line. Some use 370 gear. Others just float around and do things willy-nilly. So a lot of people crave a full 370 set. Even if they never raid. Even if they never use the gear to its full potential. Even if it takes them months longer. They don't care. Because eventually--time is the great equalizer. We'll all sit here on a patch-ull sitting in 370. The ultima raiders. The midcore crusaders, and the casual who just plays on the weekend. We all end in the same position. In a full set of 370 gear just waiting for the next treadmill race to begin--and then do it all over again.

As for me. I'll gear up just enough to not be a liability in a raid, but I won't do anything I don't enjoy to accomplish it.

I don't do savage raids or even normal raids to augment my gear.And hell no to Eureka.

Just the bare minimum Duty Roulettes weekly to get the highest iLvl tomestone gear I can get. My weapon is from Centurio seals.

With 4.4, I'm considering to stop melding my gear as well. Because the difference between melded gear and unmelded doesn't seem too much in normal content.

The way I see it, if I'm only doing MSQ,Duty Roulettes,Hunts, there's no point upgrading my gear to raid-tier only to repeat that cycle a few months down the road. The time investment is not worth it.

The only other combat related content I enjoy, is POTD/HOH and gear doesn't matter there.

While, I respect raiders for their skill,dedication and the guides, they put out on optimal rotations,etc, I'd rather be collecting glams,minions,mounts,playing the market board and socializing.