We Really Need To Talk About The State And Path Of FFXIV

[KisaiTenshi]

I disagree with statement 1. I find bricklaying soothing in real life. I know many people would be bored to tears from such an activity. But this is part of the reason why I like crafting and gathering in general is most games over combat. I'll disagree that it's the "path of least resistance", it's an activity that only certain people will find fun. I believe people would choose the path of the most fun, not least resistance in a video game. If raiders aren't actually having fun and would rather grind rocks for weeks, then there's a more fundamental problem with the raiding content then. If it's not fun, SE is doing it wrong.

If the mats were spiritbond then yes it would defeat the purpose behind locking them behind battle content. Ideally these materials should be dropped via the gathering system. Maybe via the treasure hunting system.

They don't because SE in all it's wisdom decided to just cordon off crafting from anything meaningful. Raiders may insist on sucking the fun out of their content, but crafters also do that, just they have to deal with RNGesus more.

Honestly, I don't think Minecraft/Terraria is even good at what they do, they're just RPG games where the crafting is placed in an easily accessible manner, and the combat is narrowed down to "press X to win", a real MMORPG based on this concept would never actually work, since the botters would just rip up the world, and the game would be dead within days. Plenty of MMORPG's have pseudo-sandbox crafting/resource management, but ultimately they're just unlimited resources, and thus subject to unlimited supply and scarce demand (Landmark (Everquest Next) actually did this, and it just kinda felt like "pretty minecraft" and little else.)

If FFXIV was designed around crafting being the only way to gear up, instead of winning tokens/tomes from dungeons, we would be getting a single drop of (RARE ITEM TO MAKE GREAT GEAR), and people would moan and complain about the RNG aspect of it MAYBE being a drop like it would in most other RPG's. Then you also risk destroying the item in trying to craft GREAT GEAR. The stress in crafting isn't the "crafting" but trying to get the materials in the first place, and if content keeps moving along at a pace that you can never manage to keep up with, then you'll never be able to buy those items and instead will have to hunt them yourself, thus taking time away from the part of the game you enjoy to do the frustrating part of the game.

Like there is really a formula for this, and SE just doesn't use it. Raiders seek out the rare crafting loot stuff and sell it to crafters, crafters turn around make gear and sell it to raiders, gil sloshes around between the raiders and the crafters, and sinks when raiders no longer want to do that content or crafters can't find any profit in making those items. That's why the tomes exist, so the content can still be played, even if there's no crafted gear. But in doing so, there is no incentive to even bother with the crafted gear, so crafters instead get told to do daily quests for scrips... which is their own version of tomes.

In some ways I feel that the developers just kinda forgot about crafting in FFXIV entirely. In other games, crafting the GREAT GEAR would involve things dropped from multiple pieces of content so one player could rarely make it themselves (or at least not without multiple characters since most other games don't let you change jobs.) However in practice, people just find challenge in doing content solo, and the game doesn't really incentivize you to play hard content, which is where these rare drops are supposed to exist. Even the entire "Mythic+" type of idea would hinge on there being some incentive, and if you say did M+ and got that RARE ITEM TO MAKE GEAR GREAT AGAIN, you would need it to craft the gear (or craft the key item to progress) to do the next level, or something to that idea. But knowing SE, we'd just get M+ tomes and nothing would change, and there would be no reason to ever play content cleared, just like now.

[Dualgunner]

If the mats were spiritbond then yes it would defeat the purpose behind locking them behind battle content. Ideally these materials should be dropped via the gathering system. Maybe via the treasure hunting system.

I think the least that would be accepted is dungeon drops, with about the scarcity that coke, potash, etc had, and with about the number needed for them. However, crafting mats dropping from Savage is nothing new; used to be a lot of housing items that were made with gear from Savage level content.

So there's precedent there either way, and both I think would be acceptable simultaneously.

[KageTokage]

Part of me honestly wishes that more crafting materials were BoP (Creation mats included) so as to force people to actually run content to be able to make stuff.

It would certainly alleviate issues with bot farmers to a degree.

[Magic-Mal]

OP this, OP that

I know I'm late but can you stop referring to that person(ElazulHP) as the OP? Or can you stop confusing me for ElazulHP? I never said anything you're claiming I said. It was THEM, not me. I don't understand how you haven't gotten that right.

Or are you confusing me with Edax? Because I'm not Edax either. I'm neither of them! I'm Mal, the one with coal skin.

[TheRealMadruck]

Here is the simple truth Magic Mal, SE does not care anymore! SE is not doing its best to keep FF14 relevant in comparison to Blizzard is with WoW or other MMOs. I have been saying exactly what you have been saying since the last patch of ARR in relation to no new changes we got from HW and during that time, I was trolled...insulted and belittled by the "White Knights" that will defend this game no matter how flawed it is. So if you want some advice from a person who was here way before you saying the same thing as you...don't waste your time! You will either be ostracized by the community or told to GG from FF14 for merely voicing your opinion.

P.S. I totally agree with your statement about raiders! They are killing the game. I hate WoW now but at least they learned early that casuals are the heart of this game...not the 5% who want nothing more than a Epen to show to others as the mainstay of all the clashback to any form of change to their "elitism" status. Good luck to you and I am hoping SE will actually listen to you this time.(Doubt it)

[Redname]

To everyone posting here...How many times we talked about this? In different shape and form. Only to repeat over and over what we already said.
You said its needed. Granted, nobody will listen us if we dont voice our concerns.
But we are the only ones talking now, we are talking to a brick wall. Take a look at the dev tracker. You see some dev replying something meaningful or caring about us? Only silly contests about housing or art, or pvp. The feedback from them is 0. Begin demanding real communication. Thats the only way we can advance

[MoroMurasaki]

P.S. I totally agree with your statement about raiders! They are killing the game.

I wonder how often people like this are carried through content that otherwise would just be a wipefest by the very raiders they hate on for no reason.

Begin demanding real communication. Thats the only way we can advance

I tried this. Got a ton of likes, had my thread on the front page of General Discussion for a while, never recieved any kind of response beyond mods deleting some of my posts they didn't like and couldn't be bothered to respond to.

There is no way to get real communication.

[KageTokage]

It really feels like the only time change ever happens is when both the US and JP player bases are extremely dissatisfied with something.

Which is why they'll probably never actually address the issue of bots to a meaningful degree because it's largely a non-issue on the JP side of things.

[TheRealMadruck]

I wonder how often people like this are carried through content that otherwise would just be a wipefest by the very raiders they hate on for no reason.



I tried this. Got a ton of likes, had my thread on the front page of General Discussion for a while, never recieved any kind of response beyond mods deleting some of my posts they didn't like and couldn't be bothered to respond to.

There is no way to get real communication.

Moro, in every MMO I have ever played including being a co-leader of one of the largest raiding guilds in WoW's hayday from 2004 to 2010 on my server...I never needed to get carried once. But if it makes you feel better to consider me a individual who isn't willing to earn my rewards strictly on my critique on how FF14 favors the minority in this game over the rest of the player base...have at it! Very sad though in attempt to put down my two cents into this conversation.

[Dualgunner]

I remain unconvinced that this game favors raiders over any other subgroup of players.