Now that we know SE is listening, here's how to "fix" Pagos.

[Lumis_Arvalo]

Then just wait until logos comes out and Pagos is nerfed to the ground like Anemos was.

Waiting months for newly released content to finally become enjoyable isn't a solution to the problem of it being unfun right now, and that's a ridiculous thing to tell people to do in a game with recurring fee to play.

That's like telling the people who bought No Man's Sky at launch two years ago that the game would be better in two years if only they would wait. That's utterly ridiculous to expect.

We want something fun, or at the very least tolerable. Anemos was tolerable. Pagos is neither, and we want it fixed so that we can at least tolerate doing it instead of hating the content and Squeenix for putting relics behind it. And especially because in general we KNOW how to make it tolerable, that's really not a lot for a paying customer base to ask for.

[Kyu-Momo]

I went in to pagos for chain farming for 3 hours when it first launched.... and I haven't touched it since. It is simply too boring and too unrewarding to be worth the effort, not to mention it actively discourages helping other parties because chain timing is so strict because every trash mob is an HP sponge. I had trouble getting rezs when I was literally right outside the starting base.

This feels like the Japanese devs had a tantrum and are now punishing us for doing things in anemos in ways they didn't want us to. "Wait what? The players are doing the most efficient way to level in this boring grind fest we made? Nope, not allowed! They have to do it OUR way: chain until your hands hurt too much to move!"

[Wyvernheart]

Man I had a lot of fun chaining mobs a running NMs today. Maybe this content isnt for you if you font like to grind mobs. If they do boost nm ceap they also need to boost the chain bonus for people who actually want to work for things and not ride others backs. If anything, they need to increase the item level of the reward. Also, item-poppable NMs.

Seems like most of you just want pagos easy mode. Makes me sick.

[Aster_E]

Man I had a lot of fun chaining mobs a running NMs today. Maybe this content isnt for you if you font like to grind mobs. If they do boost nm ceap they also need to boost the chain bonus for people who actually want to work for things and not ride others backs. If anything, they need to increase the item level of the reward. Also, item-poppable NMs.

Seems like most of you just want pagos easy mode. Makes me sick.

Fun is relative, and most of us want "fun mode" Pagos, as whatever the consensus might be for that. For the majority of us that means mobs that aren't so damage spongy, more convenience for getting to and from our farming spots, more thought to the fights we partake in, and a better sense of rewards. If Pagos, as it stands, is to your liking then that's great, but there are other games that do this sort of system leagues better. FFXIV is not those games, clearly.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Then just wait until logos comes out and Pagos is nerfed to the ground like Anemos was.

If everyone adopted that idea, FFXIV would be long dead. Telling players to wait until the already delayed content gets nerfed because the next step came along is an abysmal design philosophy.

And yet we complained about choices. Its not about a matter of how "minor" a voice is, its a voice they end up hearing. And a voice they acted to cater to. Plenty of people have already said it, don't do it and let them see how bad it is based on participation.

They won't make any drastic changes unless a drastic reaction happens and the amount of changes they need to do to make Pagos as "Anemos-like" to achieve NM train benefits is way too much:

*- Remove the frosted dragons
*- reduce HP of mobs
*- change the level of mounts
*- adjust aetheryte levels so people can port earlier than 30s
*- add dailies, etc.

That already amounts to "a whole new piece of content". But if they see an overall "high" participation and positive feedback in their home-front (which is the one they actually care for) then this is what it is.

Correction, we complained about certain aspects. The Atma step was an awful grind yet they've responded four times later with a comparably awful grind their combat system cannot properly handle. Either the dev team is too draft to realize people don't enjoy tedious grinds with extremely slow progression point or they simply didn't care to put forth any effort. Regardless, I do agree people should abandon Pagos and let the damn thing rot.

[Liam_Harper]

Seems like most of you just want pagos easy mode. Makes me sick.

Because Pagos is difficult? Intense gameplay hitting training dummies for 3 hours...

[InkstainedGwyn]

Man I had a lot of fun chaining mobs a running NMs today. Maybe this content isnt for you if you font like to grind mobs. If they do boost nm ceap they also need to boost the chain bonus for people who actually want to work for things and not ride others backs. If anything, they need to increase the item level of the reward. Also, item-poppable NMs.

Seems like most of you just want pagos easy mode. Makes me sick.

Pagos isn't difficult. Pagos is repetition. Over and over and over and over and over and over again. Literally the same 10 actions, the same sort of thing you can memorise by grade school. If you think this is "difficult" I can only imagine how hard you think filing a stack of paperwork or pulling weeds would be.

Edit: and before "it's only the same 10 if you don't change it up" that's literally the same thing as SE handing us a bucket of chalk and saying "amuse yourself drawing on the sidewalk". If I wanted to create my own fun, I'd buy a .99 bucket of chalk and go outside, not pay $15 for do-it-yourself content.

[DamianFatale]

- SE should of expanded upon the popular way of playing Anemos, and just added more variation to fates. Making some kind of a unique gameplay challenge to the final boss would be fun! Learn from Ratholos. People like Ratholos, because its fun, and unique.

- Lightfarming was absolutely LOATHED. To put it back is just a spit in the face to what we were complaining about. At the very least make it enjoyable.

- The music in the zone isn't any different. If we're going to spend months grinding the same zone, please add a new song for each, so that we don't get sick of the same old song. At the very least just reorchestrate it. An Ishgard sounding version would be a neat throwback for veteran players.

- I will say that the behemoth rewards are kinda nice, and that they are one of the GOOD things in dungeon. Bringing back old gear for all classes is brilliant. That's what they got right.

[DamianFatale]

We got an expert over here!

I am so sick of comment baiting in the second comments. :l

[Lumis_Arvalo]

Seems like most of you just want pagos easy mode. Makes me sick.

Let's get this straight right now because I keep seeing comments like this come up: difficulty is not the same thing as tedium.

Pagos isn't hard. Not by a longshot. Even your most basic fresh-off-the-boat player with a rudimentary understanding of their class could walk into Pagos as a fresh 70 and complete the content start to finish with enough willpower.

The thing people are complaining about is the overall tediousness and boring nature of the content. We don't mind things being challenging as long as those things are fun. Pagos isn't challenging OR fun. It's just a slog through a bunch of repetitive crap, and if the relic wasn't tied to it, no one would subject themselves to it at all because of how badly designed it is. And short of a full-on redesign (which is asking too much at this point), there's only so many ways it can be fixed to be made enjoyable. Hence this thread.

The NM train in Anemos is the key factor that made that zone tolerable because it gave players a way to be engaged in the content. The train wasn't particularily great, but it was more fun than anything that is currently going on in Pagos and if that didn't exist, Anemos would be just as unbearable as Pagos is now. If players have to come up with ways to make your content tolerable, then the design of the content is bad. The onus is on the developer to make enjoyable content that people WANT to do, not the player to "play it right" when it is terrible by nature.