People able to skip cutscenes in MSQ roullete o.o

[Nixxe]

They are actually correct, annoying as it is. Disconnecting and reconnecting skips the cutscenes. The fact that people are abusing it is worrying, though.

When people would rather force close and reboot the client a dozen times per run rather than watch the cutscenes, you'd hope the devs get the hint. Changing it the way they did was just a dumb idea.

[Dogempire]

When people would rather force close and reboot the client a dozen times per run rather than watch the cutscenes, you'd hope the devs get the hint. Changing it the way they did was just a dumb idea.

I agree, how dare these first timers enjoy the finale of the game they paid for instead of being forced to choose between missing the cutscenes or doing the fights.

How dare these new players want to enjoy the storyline instead of enjoying the experience of speedrunning the content to farm tomestones.

How dare these people not want to enjoy the authentic and extremely climactic experience of going to an inn and watching 2 dungeons worth of cutscenes after the fact because people only want to get their tomestone reward as fast as possible and then leave without saying a word. People who play this game are completely selfless and wouldn't complain about a dungeon they voluntarily que for taking much longer with no regard to the experience of the new player, nor how upset they would be watching the final cutscenes take place as they have no idea what happened between them.

Not to mention that the sentient grizzly bear that sits in your room holding a gun to your head and forcing you to que for Main Scenario roulette doesn't care how long the dungeon takes, and will make you que for the roulette every day without fail.

[Enla]

I agree, how dare these first timers enjoy the finale of the game they paid for instead of being forced to choose between missing the cutscenes or doing the fights.

How dare these new players want to enjoy the storyline instead of enjoying the experience of speedrunning the content to farm tomestones.

How dare these people not want to enjoy the authentic and extremely climactic experience of going to an inn and watching 2 dungeons worth of cutscenes after the fact because people only want to get their tomestone reward as fast as possible and then leave without saying a word. People who play this game are completely selfless and wouldn't complain about a dungeon they voluntarily que for taking much longer with no regard to the experience of the new player, nor how upset they would be watching the final cutscenes take place as they have no idea what happened between them.

Not to mention that the sentient grizzly bear that sits in your room holding a gun to your head and forcing you to que for Main Scenario roulette doesn't care how long the dungeon takes, and will make you que for the roulette every day without fail.

Where in their post were they maligning first timers?

It's pretty much universally agreed upon that those two instances were terribly designed. Which is why going forward you /never/ saw something of their ilk again within the game. I don't think most people are of the opinion that new players don't matter, or at least I've seen that sentiment slowly dissolve away as time has gone by. Rather that they feel there were better ways to fix these instances than to basically throw a bandaid at the issue and hope it goes away. Especially when not every new player appreciates being held hostage for upwards of two hours. I know I didn't back when I joined, I happily skipped the cutscenes because I found the story wanting and those dungeons did nothing to help my impression. If anything, I'd likely be browsing reddit the entire time had I come to this game after the 'fixes' were implemented.

It's very possible to want first timers to experience the dungeons in an organic way while finding the current solution lacking in almost every way. If I were to suggest a new one, I would point to Kaiva's thoughts on the matter.

[Dogempire]

Where in their post were they maligning first timers?

It's pretty much universally agreed upon that those two instances were terribly designed. Which is why going forward you /never/ saw something of their ilk again within the game. I don't think most people are of the opinion that new players don't matter, or at least I've seen that sentiment slowly dissolve away as time has gone by. Rather that they feel there were better ways to fix these instances than to basically throw a bandaid at the issue and hope it goes away. Especially when not every new player appreciates being held hostage for upwards of two hours. I know I didn't back when I joined, I happily skipped the cutscenes because I found the story wanting and those dungeons did nothing to help my impression. If anything, I'd likely be browsing reddit the entire time had I come to this game after the 'fixes' were implemented.

It's very possible to want first timers to experience the dungeons in an organic way while finding the current solution lacking in almost every way. If I were to suggest a new one, I would point to Kaiva's thoughts on the matter.

The current solution is fine. If the dungeon dropped a random piece of i370 gear that you don't already have each time you did the roulette, people would still complain about the time it takes to run the dungeon because people in this game are impatient and only want more in the least amount of time possible. It's especially obvious when tanks run older content and just pull the entire dungeon without at least speaking a word to the healer first.

The current rewards are well worth the time considering you can literally just pull up a youtube video and watch something while the cutscene plays out instead of skipping everything, pulling everything, ignoring the new player, and starting the bosses without them, locking them out. If you don't want to spend an hour in a dungeon, then don't que up for it.

Also, no they didn't malign new players, but I'm sick of people justifying ruining people's experience with one of the most important dungeons in the game storywise. The entire solution of "Watch the cutscenes at the inn" is stupid because you watch all the other post-dungeon scenes before you get a chance to go to the inn to fill in the gaps between the two events of oh I don't know, stepping off a ship and everything being reduced to smoldering ash and then blowing up.

[Mwynn]

If you don't want to spend an hour in a dungeon, then don't que up for it.

Ya, I think 95% of the Community does it already. There is better things to do then burning ones self out on a 2.0 Story Dungeon.

The Rewards doesn't matter, current 4.3 Endgame Dungeons give 50 Mendacity, the Story Roulette gives 50 Mendacity, what's more efficience...

I mean I have New Players complaining about the Two Dungeons already due of Queueing Issues (Taking too long), so apparently the Situation is even worser then before.

[Dogempire]

Ya, I think 95% of the Community does it already. There is better things to do then burning ones self out on a 2.0 Story Dungeon.

I mean I have New Players complaining about the Two Dungeons already due of Queueing Issues (Taking too long), so apparently the Situation is even worser then before.

I've noticed ques get way longer than usual when it's past a certain time late at night (Say 1 or 2 am) even on somewhat relevant content (Deltascape for instance) when queing on a healer, so it could just be the time of day that they que up.

That being said, I wouldn't be opposed to them increasing the MSQ roulette reward, I know it gives a ridiculous amount of XP but it wouldn't be a bad idea to make it give 75 or maybe even 100 mendacity tomestones instead of 50 for people who que up on maxed out classes and want to cap their tomes from running a dungeon that's more lengthy than difficult.

[Iscah]

In the old system, where cutscenes are skippable, players could have politely waited on the occasions when one player was watching the cutscenes. With lots of people running the roulette, the chances of your party getting that new person should be relatively low. There would be a gamble of your time when you queue for it - will you get a party that can speed through, or not? - but first-timers get their climactic finale and everyone else gets their 15-minute run most days.

Instead, people refused to wait - and so the developers have had to "take a side", decided the new player's experience is more important and the (only?) way to ensure that, at least without heavily revisiting the content, is to make the others wait. And if the game framework doesn't allow for dynamic "sometimes forced, sometimes not" cutscenes then the only way to achieve that is to make everyone wait, every time.

Ideally there could have been some kind of warning before it happened - "if you don't voluntarily wait for new players, we will have to force everyone to watch cutscenes every time" - and maybe people would have listened to that and realised it would be better to wait sometimes than to lose the "quick run" entirely.

(I'm guessing the game's coding means they are not able to implement a dynamic "unskippable cutscenes only with a new player present" setup, or they would have done so - but in any case it comes back to the ideal scenario of the old system. If people chose to wait for new players when necessary, that would have the same final outcome, without needing to force it at a programming level.)

Where in their post were they maligning first timers?

Saying that "changing it the way they did was just a dumb idea" can come across that way, because the change was specifically meant to help first-timers. Thus, an interpretation that 'changing it for the sake of first timers was a dumb idea'.

[BillyKaplan]

(I'm guessing the game's coding means they are not able to implement a dynamic "unskippable cutscenes only with a new player present" setup, or they would have done so - but in any case it comes back to the ideal scenario of the old system. If people chose to wait for new players when necessary, that would have the same final outcome, without needing to force it at a programming level.)

The devs have proven time and again that when they want to, they can make anything happen in this game. The code is theirs, they can do whatever they want with it. Question is, do they want to (broad 'want' term that also includes priorities and outside interference from higherups). The answer seems to be 'no' as this very 'solution' we were given only shows how little they actually want to bother with this.
And you can talk about that ideal until you're blue in the face, the fact remains we never saw anything like that in the game again. ARF and Ala Mhigo were both normal, zero-cutscene dungeons. Thordan and Shinryu were separated from the dungeons leading up to them so that people can enjoy the cutscenes in between dungeon and trial at their leisure. There's no need to defend the design, still existing in the MSQ roulette dungeons like a scorned lover, when the devs themselves acknowledge it's bad by never once having repeated it.

Saying that "changing it the way they did was just a dumb idea" can come across that way, because the change was specifically meant to help first-timers. Thus, an interpretation that 'changing it for the sake of first timers was a dumb idea'.

We've seen plenty of first timers complain about this change, so even portions of the target demographic think it's, shall we call it, less than ideal.

[Nixxe]

I agree, how dare these first timers enjoy the finale of the game they paid for instead of being forced to choose between missing the cutscenes or doing the fights.

How dare these new players want to enjoy the storyline instead of enjoying the experience of speedrunning the content to farm tomestones.

How dare these people not want to enjoy the authentic and extremely climactic experience of going to an inn and watching 2 dungeons worth of cutscenes after the fact because people only want to get their tomestone reward as fast as possible and then leave without saying a word. People who play this game are completely selfless and wouldn't complain about a dungeon they voluntarily que for taking much longer with no regard to the experience of the new player, nor how upset they would be watching the final cutscenes take place as they have no idea what happened between them.

Not to mention that the sentient grizzly bear that sits in your room holding a gun to your head and forcing you to que for Main Scenario roulette doesn't care how long the dungeon takes, and will make you que for the roulette every day without fail.

That is an intense persecution complex.

It's possible to realize the experience sucks for new players without taking it out on the veteran players by making an even worse bandaid fix. I don't queue for MSQ by the way. It's a roulette that I lost because of the idiotic change they made to it. You clearly think yourself a spokesperson for new players, but I know when I was a new player I started skipping cut scenes because I felt bad for not helping. Knowing everyone is stuck watching 30 minutes of mostly useless filler each time they do it just so I could watch them in peace wouldn't feel any better. I watched every single other cut scene the first time through, but Praetorium is absurd and I just went back and watched them in the inn. When the roles were reversed and I was the veteran player, I had no issue if people watched the cut scenes. It takes like three people to clear Praetorium, so they're not hurting anything. That's the way it should have been left.

This way though? People obviously hate it. I'd be very surprised if participation rates aren't lower than they previously were, which means higher queue times for players who actually need to clear the content. If they fix people alt+f4ing out of it, those people will probably stop queuing for it as well, further driving up queue times. People who would rather new players have an ideal experience or none at all, even if the latter is an inadvertent consequence, are not friends to new players, no matter how they may see themselves.

[Dogempire]

That is an intense persecution complex.

>Cares about others and their experiences with the game instead of only myself and my tomestones
>Persecution complex