Confused about people's obsession with open world raids/dungeons.

[Coglin]

You are right, that is exactly what this thread is about. There are just a lot of folk who aren't getting it. The folks who want open world competition are full of slippery slopes: No, the thread is about how before you ninja edited your first post, you said that all end game content should be instance, and then you argued how no end game content should be open world.

-They say botting is not an excuse because you can bot instances, but what they don't get is that botting in an instance doesn't screw anyone over. I say cheating is cheating. And if your not agaist policing boting as a whole then your for it. Policing boting should be enforced not limiting content because of it.

-They say instances are boring because who wants to sit in town and teleport to a dungeon, when that is not at all necessary. Nobody is teleporting to darkhold. They also don't realise they are sitting in town just the same spamming for a party to go a kill an open world nm just like they would spam for a party to go complete an instance. No, this is not actually the case, but it does demonstrate how you attept to ignore inconvenitent truths. I do not sit around town at all. I and many from 2 of my LS actual used the group search and found group there, believe or not. We also had multiple LS we formed parties from as well as friends list. The only time I got to town is to hit the wards for supplies. You have develped a strong knack for stereotyping players in this thread to suit your needs.

-They use bowl of embers as an example as to why dungeons lack exploration, when that is a flaw with design, not a flaw with instances. Instances can be as big and massive as they decide to create them. Not really, none of the dungeons we have leave much to explore. "Can be" and "are" are two diffeent things.

-They say instances cause people to /afk at the aeth waiting all day for a party when all they do is /afk at an NM's spawn waiting for it the same way :S. Clearly you tell convienent lies to avoid the inconvienent truth. You are so against OW material that we have no reason to believe your around any of it to know what people do there anyway. Its a rarety to see a sight you claim as common, here. One more testimate that you make statements based on how you want the system to be as compared to its reality.

-They say they want to meet random people to help them kill these open world NMs but they are definitely going to use their LS or find a pt in town, so point moot. Again you make up convenient lies and assumptions to tell us how we will play. Sure we will use LS and friends list, but once the working group registry gets fixed the efficiency to shout in towns will be eliviated. Not that this arguement holds any logic, as before ifrit, all you heard in shouts in towns was players trying to form instanced parties for toto and DH.

-They say a lot of things that I, and many others, have refuted, but they insist that my points have been refuted over and over, which I have yet to see because all arguments entail slippery slopes.Thats you opinion, not the general concesus. Intertaining how you stat it as if by some illogical means of magic that it becomes fact because you spew it on to the forums.

Matter of fact they are such trolls by nature they will read through this post and analyze the crap out of it to make and when they realize that a few of my points aren't exactly slippery slopes I see, anyone who disagrees with you and supports policing of bots is a troll. Wierd, I always though posters who were against pushing for policing of bots and wanted to limit content because of it were trolls.

they will say im a dumbass You called it, not me.

who doesn't know what a slippery slope is. Which has nothing to do with the argument. If you want to dee everything a slippery slop, how does it become less relavent to the debate? The real issue is you originally posted to have all endgame material instanced and spoke against OW material, and when you realized the debate was 25 to 1 agaist you and everyone bashed you for it, you attepted to ninja edit your post 3 days later and lies about the original stance.

Raffle Faffle. <-this part I totally agree with

You use the same crystal ball to make all these false assumptions that you used to detirmine CON = BLM and THM = WHM also?

[OranKells]

there are merits to both sides but let me just say that Sky and Sea were two of my favorite things from ffxi. 10-20 people going about the entire region, farming things, looking for pop times and whatnot. it scaled from easy breezy, to jesus flossing christ save me. I always thought a little competition made it fun, but if there were already 2 or three linkshells out and about we had more than enough things to go off and do something else. it was also largely a social experience that the majority of the linkshell could participate in.

we didn't have too many instances in xi, limbus, BCNMs, later on assualts and salvage, closed off requiring specific technical and strategic expertise from a specific number of people with fancy shmancy rewards. even dynamis was sorta instanced.


Sorry getting kinda nostalgic but before I lose myself in memory lane my point is that there is room for both and I don't understand why we need to pick one over the other .

[Lucifer]

WiiSam doesn't even know what he is trying to get at.

[Siafu]

The way the game is set up right now, instanced encounters only allow one group. Thats where I take issue, I want content that requires more then 1 group as an option, so I can bring 3 groupd from my LS, to kill a mob that takes 20-25 players to kill. Let the bots claim that if they exist there. If someone besides my raid pary had 20-25 people there and ready, then they are entitled to it, if they claim it first. If they don't have a full raid party there, they die, and lose the claim anyway, and it no longer becomes an issue.

I agree with you on this one, I personally like big group content instanced or open world.

I've read several post in this thread and I would like to put my two cents on it.

I myself like Open World more so than Instanced areas with way the things are in FFXIV. With Instanced areas you are set to the group limit specified by SE. I will give Ifrit for an example, you are in a group with ls of 8 doing Ifrit then someone gets wife aggro and has to go. You are stuck outside unable to enter with 7 members who can still easily take down Ifrit. You are stuck for awhile looking for someone to replace him if no one is available and will have to call it a day if you can't find one. Also have the issue with making ls events of limited Instanced Raids. You can have more than 8 members wanting to go but only 8 can get in and the ones who aren't in the first group will more than likely feel left out. With open world everyone can participate even if not in the claiming group. If they implement group alliances and tailor instanced dungeons for it that would be ok in my book.

FFXIV can have Open World and Instanced raids as long as its balanced with the gear drops aren't better than the other. They can spread set drop out between the 2 like having 3 pieces drop Instanced while the other 2 drop from open world. There will be competition no matter what and that whats make playing online fun. Either its out claiming someone on a open world NM or being the first ls to do this.

Like Oran Kells said Sky was one of my favorite Open World areas. It spread out the work for an ls to farm the drops and everyone who was able to come could contribute to the efforts. It was also fun cause you had to camp several NM's for pop items to pop another NM which in turn drop another pop item to pop the final NM and all dropped gear items. After a few days of work to farm those triggers and beat Kirin was real accomplishment because you put in work for it.

[WiiSam]

You use the same crystal ball to make all these false assumptions that you used to detirmine CON = BLM and THM = WHM also?

You missed the whole point of each of my points. Also, I left my original post at the top of the OP, untouched, so everyone can see what changed. Everything that was in the original OP is still there in quotation marks. All you did was call me a liar to "refute" my posts. You didn't explain or actually refute anything.

Rofl and you said that because you and TWO other LS members use the CURRENT party search that somehow everyone else does? And then you say I spew out stuff that I think everyone does? The current party search sucks and HARDLY anybody uses it. Fail.

Oh and I was also never involved in any WHM BLM argument so I don't know what you're talking about. I could give a flying F*$! whether thm is blm or whm.

[WiiSam]

The way the game is set up right now, instanced encounters only allow one group. Thats where I take issue, I want content that requires more then 1 group as an option, so I can bring 3 groupd from my LS, to kill a mob that takes 20-25 players to kill. Let the bots claim that if they exist there. If someone besides my raid pary had 20-25 people there and ready, then they are entitled to it, if they claim it first. If they don't have a full raid party there, they die, and lose the claim anyway, and it no longer becomes an issue.

So your argument for open world is to use more than one party. So if SE gives you an instance that allows more than one party aka a "raid" as per wow, you'll be happy? That isn't an argument for open world content, thats an argument for "SE please gives us content to do as multiple parties" because right now nothing in the game is intended to be accomplished by more than 8 players. And that has nothing to do with open world dungeons vs instanced dungeons.

[darkstarpoet1]

i'll still stay with my original opinion. i prefer open world content because of the competition. i like to run instanced content as well. i like both and would like to see content of both types in the game. there is absolutely NO reason to make only one type of content.

i get it sam, you prefer instanced content and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. i prefer open world content and there is nothing wrong with that either. the dev team should not make all content to be what you want no more than it should make it all for me. they should make content for both of us. give you some instanced stuff and give me some open world stuff.

by the looks of the responses in this thread you wouldn't want them to give a players poll on it. you would be out voted by at least 25-1 in favor of open world content.

[WiiSam]

by the looks of the responses in this thread you wouldn't want them to give a players poll on it. you would be out voted by at least 25-1 in favor of open world content.

I respectfully disagree and I want to thank you for being civilized unlike a few others. I would love it if there was a players poll about this. But the poll has to be specific " Do you want open-world competition ie roaming NMs and out door dungeons/coffers/nms/loot"

I would love to see that poll to finally squash this argument. In my opinion open worldwould be out voted 20-1. Elitist like open world competition, and im sorry to say, elitists are far and few between. I'm sorry if the word elitist came out negative, but I am just using a plain word. WoW has proven that the majority of people prefer instances. And before you say "this isn't WoW" you have to remember that folks who were really into ffxi are the minority in this community.

But in short, that poll would be great, hopefully in the third players poll (which comes out in January I think yoshi said?) that question will be included.

[TheFatHousecat]

And before you say "this isn't WoW" you have to remember that folks who were really into ffxi are the minority in this community.

LOL WAT........

[Splice]

And before you say "this isn't WoW" you have to remember that folks who were really into ffxi are the minority in this community.

hahaha this is a joke