Now that SMN have Bahamut can we have the others?

[CorbinDallas]

So what you're saying is that it's impossible for literally anyone else to summon either Shiva/Tsukiyomi, even though the basic rules of primal summoning dictate otherwise? Sure they would more than likely look different to the incarnations we've already seen, but it isn't completely outside of the realms of possibility.

My reply earlier was directed at the comment about us not knowing if it's possible to summon without a host body, when everything we've learned about primals indicates otherwise.

[kikix12]

I don't think so... Shiva was only able to be summoned because Ysayle believed she was the reincarnation Shiva (and if we summon Shiva, then it's disrespecting both Hraesvelgr and Ysayle). The other one I don't think can even be summoned at all unless we have that mirror (and honestly, why would anyone want to summon a heartless monster?). That's just the full forms, though.

A primal is merely a thought manifested. The mirror for Tsukuyomi or the host for both of those and Thordan...Those are irrelevant.

Thordan wanted to become primal, that's why he BECAME the primal. He didn't want to summon one.
Ysayle wanted to soothe the grief of Hraesvelg and was willing to offer herself for that cause. That's why she turned into Shiva.
And "Tsuyu" became Tsukuyomi because she wanted to take revenge personally and the mirror simply was a focus to direct her to the goal.

If someone else wanted to summon Shiva, but not want to become her, it would succeed. Shiva so summoned would also be however the summoner made it to be. Like the quest with Titan summoned by the young kobolt. His grief made Titan, the protector of kobolds, harm kobolds...and try to wreck even more destruction onto many more kobolds. That's because they are not creatures per se...Just the thoughts of what one believes in given form and power by the crystals, with their nature twisting those wishes to suck the land dry of ether.

[Brightshadow]

A primal is merely a thought manifested. The mirror for Tsukuyomi or the host for both of those and Thordan...Those are irrelevant.

Thordan wanted to become primal, that's why he BECAME the primal. He didn't want to summon one.
Ysayle wanted to soothe the grief of Hraesvelg and was willing to offer herself for that cause. That's why she turned into Shiva.
And "Tsuyu" became Tsukuyomi because she wanted to take revenge personally and the mirror simply was a focus to direct her to the goal.

If someone else wanted to summon Shiva, but not want to become her, it would succeed. Shiva so summoned would also be however the summoner made it to be. Like the quest with Titan summoned by the young kobolt. His grief made Titan, the protector of kobolds, harm kobolds...and try to wreck even more destruction onto many more kobolds. That's because they are not creatures per se...Just the thoughts of what one believes in given form and power by the crystals, with their nature twisting those wishes to suck the land dry of ether.

Agreed, who says we can't see the spirit of Ysayle in a quest or one of her followers who teach us to summon shiva. This is a game anything is possible. And it's time that the other summons actually look like summons, sure bahamut got some complaints but overall everyone is happy with him. I think we should aim for the original 6 first since they relate to summoner so deeply, then perhaps add more glamours like a tsukuyomi glamour for shiva, and alexander glamour for bahamut.

Actually thinking about it, I would really love to see Ysayle come back as a spirit to offer us a shiva trial to obtain her similar to how we obtain ramuh in FF9 that was pretty epic.

If bard could get so much love, I think summoner could get a little loving too, heck if you want you can even sell some primal glamours in the cash shop, but the ARR elemental primals and bahamut should definitely be a free part of the job.

[LineageRazor]

Asking for more distinct egis is a waste of time. Even with three, there's one never used, and another used 90% of the time. Any new one added would either be obsolete out of the box, or become the new always-use egi, sending the rest to the bench.

Better to focus on adding new egi glamours, a request much more likely to receive attention. Development time for adding a new model that performs existing abilities is a lot less than creating a whole new egi with new abilities that need to be tested and balanced.

That said, the fact that we got a bunch Carbuncles for our original batch - all of which have the same animations, many of which were already created thanks to the ACN class - makes me fearful that that is all we'll ever see. If, after such a long delay, they were only able to come up with ONE new egi model, it bodes ill for our prospects of seeing any more.

[RyuDragnier]

If SMN were to get anything dealing with the other summons, it should be akin to classic FF summoning. Meaning you summon the egi (preferably bahamut-egi sized) for a single attack, and then it leaves. If they wanted just 3, the Warring Triad would be absolutely perfect. If 4, add in Shinryu-egi.

[Shiroe]

bards get to play real music..

give us summoners something too, .. let us glamour our eggis with minions of our choice xD

[Makimaki_sargatanas]

If SMN were to get anything dealing with the other summons, it should be akin to classic FF summoning. Meaning you summon the egi (preferably bahamut-egi sized) for a single attack, and then it leaves. If they wanted just 3, the Warring Triad would be absolutely perfect. If 4, add in Shinryu-egi.

The single attack summon should be like using the Magicite in HoH.

[Marxam]

I would actually prefer to have the glamours and accompanying animations instead, since the trinity of egis is pretty much balanced for all intended purposes. Like if you switch Garuda to a Ramuh egi all attack animations will have a thunder animation. What would be cool is if they introduced Alexander "Judgement Trance" to complement Bahamut "Dreadwyrm Trance". I imagine it's auto attacks would be aoes and it's final move Divine Judgment would be a larger aoe with no split damage. Bahamut for single target and Alexander for mobs.

[Grimoire-M]

I'd much rather see SE fix the clunky phase based rotation SMN's kit currently uses rather than add more egis. If they want to do the latter I agree they should be glamours. Probably as micro-transactions too, if people really want them so badly. But imo it's such a low priority compared to fixing how SMN operates now. Seriously, there are so many QoL issues that it's insane. DWT's changes in 4.1 were a bandaid and everyone knows it.

[Nemekh]

Grimoire, you overstate the overall clunk and are favouring a derail of this thread in favour of pushing a personal agenda rather than keeping to the topic. We aren't 4.0 SMN and by the look of things per your suggestions, I'm skeptical that you actively play the job in its current form. The only points I can consider agreeing on is pertaining to how the Enhanced Enkindle trait with Further Ruin procs is poor design and Aether stack clunk in general, however, these have been complaints shared by many since SB was very first released.

Re: OP I am excited about the possibilities of where Demi-Eikons will lead us in the future as Bahamut was certainly a step in the right direction for that feel of what is Summoner. However, people tend to be splintered in how they feel about carrying on further down the Dreadwyrm bias vs cultivating other kinds of Primal aether in favour of bringing forth others. I'd love to see a variety and it's neat what they've shown with the magicite unleashing Primal Rage from our own WoL's memories, but I also have no qualms if design, later on, goes down the path of Demi-Bahamut even getting a trait for Lohs Daih, channeling that raw Meracydian pain and becoming Golden. That form is one amazing character model, it's so much more detailed and pretty than the standard Bahamut Prime variant for Demi.