Can RDM get a little bit of love...

[Bourne_Endeavor]

the problem is dualcast rez, it's strong enough that if we get any sort of direct buff. it could make smn and blm less than stellar. Unfortunately even if we saw a potency gain, if it doesn't make us the best caster. the community will just treats the job like it's bad.

Except... it isn't. While valuable, dualcast raise only really benefits initial prog. Once you've seen the mechanics, RDM's lackluster damage makes SMN a far superior choice. Keep in mind, SMN has a raise too. So you don't necessarily have to clear the mechanic but simply see it once or twice. If people are still making mistakes, well, SMN can pick them up and will help alleviate the lost rDPS better.

[Wayfinder3]

Except... it isn't. While valuable, dualcast raise only really benefits initial prog. Once you've seen the mechanics, RDM's lackluster damage makes SMN a far superior choice. Keep in mind, SMN has a raise too. So you don't necessarily have to clear the mechanic but simply see it once or twice. If people are still making mistakes, well, SMN can pick them up and will help alleviate the lost rDPS better.

Yes but advocating that rdm is poorly balanced because of verrraise isn't the same as saying verraise shouldn't be the reason why rdm is where it is. RDM has low dps because in prog if it could pick up an entire team"hyperbole" or even 2 within the 60secs it would take any of the healers to do while doing more comparable damage to the other casters, SMN & BLM would be practically worthless. It's a very powerful utility when it works, and it does work. I will not discredit the claim that it falls off after prog and i understand that you believe it shouldn't be balanced around verraise but, as of now verraise is far too powerful "when" it works to ignore.

RDM is balanced around verraise correctly, if we want more from the job. ASK for a rework and the removal of dualcast rez instead of meaningless potency increases that won't mean anything if they don't make the job closer to it's counterparts. Lets also be realistic, if rdm gets buffed to where it's more valuable than SMN and BLM, it's going to still have compete with MCH and the double ranged meta

we don't want rdm monoplizing the prog meta because that doesn't fix anything and any buff to post progression is also a buff to progression (AST cards aren't weaker in progression). SMN being able to rez means nothing if rdm can do it better and, it can. SMN is high dps low rez, RDM high rez, low dps and thats a fair way to balance the job even if we all don't agree with it. Verraise is that so powerful don't undervalue it

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Yes but advocating that rdm is poorly balanced because of verrraise isn't the same as saying verraise shouldn't be the reason why rdm is where it is. RDM has low dps because in prog if it could pick up an entire team"hyperbole" or even 2 within the 60secs it would take any of the healers to do while doing more comparable damage to the other casters, SMN & BLM would be practically worthless. It's a very powerful utility when it works, and it does work. I will not discredit the claim that it falls off after prog and i understand that you believe it shouldn't be balanced around verraise but, as of now verraise is far too powerful "when" it works to ignore.

RDM is balanced around verraise correctly, if we want more from the job. ASK for a rework and the removal of dualcast rez instead of meaningless potency increases that won't mean anything if they don't make the job closer to it's counterparts. Lets also be realistic, if rdm gets buffed to where it's more valuable than SMN and BLM, it's going to still have compete with MCH and the double ranged meta

we don't want rdm monoplizing the prog meta because that doesn't fix anything and any buff to post progression is also a buff to progression (AST cards aren't weaker in progression). SMN being able to rez means nothing if rdm can do it better and, it can. SMN is high dps low rez, RDM high rez, low dps and thats a fair way to balance the job even if we all don't agree with it. Verraise is that so powerful don't undervalue it

And as noted by JohnnyDevo above, you won't meet enrage under those circumstances in any fight with a strict enough enrage where death matters. You aren't clearing Guardian and God Kefka early into the tier with several deaths in quick succession. Clown Kefka's DPS check within the first few weeks was harder to meet than anything in Ultimate. RDM's value plummets in such a scenario because 2-4 deaths means, you wipe. Go back and stop dying. Even in more casual settings, people still prefer wiping after multiple deaths in lieu of saving a run because it's less of a strain and, admittedly, parses.

Buffing RDM's numbers slightly does not mean it monopolizes prog anymore than WHM does. It means players won't be gimping their party by an absurdly high rDPS loss. Currently, SMN contributes 600 more pDPS while offering comparable utility. That's the equivalent of Trick Attack or Disembowel+Battle Litany with BRD. We can close the gap without RDM suddenly dominating prog.

If it must be a dichotomy, I would rather RDM have a significant DPS and/or utility buff with Verraise getting a 60sec lock than keep things as they are. Frankly, all three casters need to be looked at because the answer remains "SMN" in virtually all scenarios.

[MoroMurasaki]

If it must be a dichotomy, I would rather RDM have a significant DPS and/or utility buff with Verraise getting a 60sec lock than keep things as they are. Frankly, all three casters need to be looked at because the answer remains "SMN" in virtually all scenarios.

Please, please this. Exactly this. All of this.

Anyone who thinks RDM should be Rezmage must not understand feeling their damage bottom out while chainressing several people.

[GunksFoy]

snip

I have long said that Summoner needs nerfed, or both of the other casters need buffed, but preferably the former. Summoner is too close to Black Mage in pDPS to compensate the rDPS they bring as well as the Raise utility. I'm not sure what to do with Red Mage honestly. I love playing it (not as much as Black Mage), but the low DPS pushes me away from it. When I can deal as much damage as an i262 Black Mage as some of the highest Red Mage parses, it's a tough pill to swallow. I don't know how much of a pDPS buff Red Mages can get without Dual-Raise becoming too powerful, but I would definitely support some Utility/rDPS increases.

[Dualgunner]

I have long said that Summoner needs nerfed, or both of the other casters need buffed, but preferably the former.

I would argue the latter is the better option. It's been brought up in either this or the "So, About Summoner..." thread, but Black Mage, Red Mage, and Summoner are not alone in their war for the fourth DPS slot in the party: they are also competing against Machinist and, in any fight that allows triple melee, Monk. Summoner is at a place where it offers legitimate challenge against the established Physical Ranged meta, and to nerf it wouldn't help Red Mages and Black Mages who just don't want to play Summoner; it would only shift the job which they're pestered into swapping to.

[GunksFoy]

Snip

You make a lot of great points here. I actually think Black Mage could use a fairly large buff because it has 0 rDPS contribution and is quite difficult to master (despite a seriously simplistic rotation) in high level content, and they provide no utility outside Cross-class. Summoner is honestly just too close to be fair. Even Monks have gotten very close and they bring a fair amount of rDPS and utility, i.e. Brotherhood and Mantra. But, buff BLM too much and you end up with them being too good. Samurais could likely use the same treatment, but I don't play it all and don't have an opinion, though at least they have Slashing (worthless as that is in the meta). As for Red Mage, I don't know enough about them to offer detailed changes, but I generally agree with you that they need buffed in some way.