Tales from Duty Finder: Some make you laugh, some make you cry. Let's vent.

[Vlhana]

Had a nightmare run of The Aery last night. I've been leveling WHM for shorter queue times, so I thought I was the problem when the tank started dropping over 1000 HP in one server tick on the first trash pull. After a wipe to trash and a nightmare of a time trying to keep this guy alive, I finally realized that I may not be the problem. Lo and behold, he was in mostly Ironworks gear. In The Aery.

Oh, and there was the Aurum Vale run where I accidentally used my text Raise macro on Coincounter. That was awkward.

[Maeka]

Had a nightmare run of The Aery last night. I've been leveling WHM for shorter queue times, so I thought I was the problem when the tank started dropping over 1000 HP in one server tick on the first trash pull. After a wipe to trash and a nightmare of a time trying to keep this guy alive, I finally realized that I may not be the problem. Lo and behold, he was in mostly Ironworks gear. In The Aery.

Oh, and there was the Aurum Vale run where I accidentally used my text Raise macro on Coincounter. That was awkward.

Ironworks is not that big of a problem in the Aery. In fact, I've tanked Ravana in full Ironworks and it was fine, and Ravana is IIRC 53 or 54, and Trial bosses are always harder than normal dungeon content.

Ironworks is equivalent to Lv54 gear (just slightly worse, but not heavily so), and the Aery is what again, 55?

You should look at his jewelry -- was he wearing Ironworks of Fending, or Ironworks of Striking? For awhile there, I know on forums and in game I heard a lot of talk about how tanks at endgame should be wearing DPS jewelry and I wouldn't be surprised if this guy heard that and put on a bunch of Striking stuff wherever he could because he heard that's what tanks "should do" (except for the fact, they were talking about endgame!).

That, or he was just unsynch'd. Was he pulling two groups at a time? No tank that is unsynch'd should be pulling two groups at a time unless he's well-geared.

EDIT: Also, what stance (if any) was he in? Sometimes on the first pull I forget to put up stance. I know a lot of tanks think they can muscle their way through the dungeon in DPS stance even at lower levels, even sometimes unsynch'd. They usually learn the hard way and switch rather quickly.

[Skivvy]

First pull i can understand being thrown off a little by the arena shift. But im gonna agree with Maeka, by 50 a healer should have developed some sort of instinct of "People are dying? Time to heal harder". So if they were caught off guard and underhealed the first go, that second pull they should have been more on point then that. I dont know if anyone explained the "pop all cooldowns before being sucked in" part to make it easier, but this isnt some sort of tricky new healer mechanic. Its just a lot of arena wide attacks coming in short succession. Their previous 49 levels(plus all the other trials going through the 2.x patch series) should have been enough to prepare for that.

So let me preface this by saying I love healing, have been a WHM main since my XI days, but I struggled something fierce when it came to leveling AST to 70. While it wasn't often by any means, I had some moments where I completely blanked mid-fight. I'm not sure if it was the juggling of cards, or perhaps the lack of almost-infinite MP like WHM, or just the unfamiliarity of the class, but yeah, I went full-on deer in headlights mode. lol. It was awful, and I caused some questionable wipes on the newer dungeons that I could breeze through on my WHM.

Now I'm the type of person that will always apologize if I do something stupid, so perhaps that helps to defuse things within the party, but I do know personally sometimes people can just blank when in a new situation. I was being the bad healer in those instances as my reflexes just didn't kick in, much like the healers in the story above, but I would have been equally annoyed had I received some snarky replies over a mistake that was remedied on the next attempt.

[Maeka]

I suppose each person is different? I don't know. I've not tried AST yet, but with SCH, there's not really very many mechanics that I've run into yet (mine's 48) and the mechanics that are there are simply balancing between using Physick or Adlo and last thing they gave me was Succor.

The thing is, though, is that this wasn't "one attempt to remedy the problem" but "two more attempts to remedy the problem".

The healers had their theoretical "deer in headlight moment" during Wipe #1. And then they did the exact same thing during Wipe #2; they just stood there with their thumbs up their butts not healing dying people.

Maybe the AST has a lot of mechanics you must pay attention to, I don't know. But there was a SCH in the group too and you've got 3 spells to use in that situation -- Physick, Adloquium, and Succor (unless you get a 4th at 50, I don't know that yet). The entire raid is missing half of their health.

Do you...

1). Cast Physick?
2). Cast Adloquium?
3). Cast Succor? (<--obvious choice, IMO, if the raid is half-dead to cast the one AoE spell you have)
4). Stand there and do absolutely nothing while everybody drops dead around you.

I'm REALLY not trying to be snide here, but c'mon. Nobody was new to the duty, that I remember. Pretty sure there was no newbie bonus, because I typically watch for that in complicated fights like Chrysalis. If I see the newbie bonus, you better bet your PJs that I will be typing politely worded instructions before the battle starts. Especially on fights like Nabriales, Nidhogg, Moggle Mog, etc where 1-2 clueless people could easily wipe the whole raid.

But.... I didn't see the "Newbie" warning so I assumed peeps knew what to do or at least their memory would be refreshed as the fight progressed. Now, I did my usual "please remember to lb3 the tear" as I always do as a reminder so the DPS don't stare slackjawed at the tear while we all poison to death. Now the healers claimed they were new to the duty, but I think they meant "new to HEALING the duty". And I understand that, but again, half-dead raid and the remedy to such is universal to all duties.

[Mesarthim]

Did trials on WHM. Got Ravana and I chose to abandon it after one run. It's not really that uncommon for there to be one wipe but it's what happened during that one wipe that annoyed the seven hells out of me.

I'm assuming one tank was new as they had the cutscene so the experienced paladin went Shield Oath. The new paladin also went Shield Oath and started an aggro war. Things went mostly fine until add phase (shocker). We had one sword dropped by a moon gana and two lesser adds dropping a sword as well because the dps are tunnel visioning. The end result is I'm dead, and 3 dps are dead. The remaining people are nearly dead and have 3 stacks.

The remainder of the run was the tanks cleaving the party and the other healer being knocked off despite having mp and not dying to bloody fuller (they got lucky). I could not maintain mp because lucid was on cooldown for nearly 40 seconds after I had been revived (everyone having 3 vuln stacks didnt help). Then the summoner (who decided to use titan and ONLY titan) wasted the LB when I needed to be the one to use it (other healer could not be revived). Said summoner also decided to summon titan back before the second run began.

tl;dr DPS being DPS and not doing trial mechanics, tanks fighting for aggro and cleaving the party, and a wasted LB (by the titan summoner).

[RubixCube]

Snip

Just to say, the faerie also plays into your toolkit in that situation, if she is on obey and hasn’t blown WD twenty seconds earlier.

I would cast succor and get the faerie to cast whispering dawn then fey illumination in tandem with another succor if necessary. SCH burst healing at level 50 isn’t the best - succor is mp expensive and lustrate (level 50 aether heal) can only be used three times on single targets before that runs out. So it can be hard for an undergeared scholar to quickly recover an entire party.

But then, that’s why there are two healers, to cover the other’s weaknesses. The AST should have been all over that. Though if it IS their first raid, they might have been overwhelmed. I dunno xD

[Frizze]

So let me preface this by saying I love healing, have been a WHM main since my XI days, but I struggled something fierce when it came to leveling AST to 70. While it wasn't often by any means, I had some moments where I completely blanked mid-fight. I'm not sure if it was the juggling of cards, or perhaps the lack of almost-infinite MP like WHM, or just the unfamiliarity of the class, but yeah, I went full-on deer in headlights mode. lol. It was awful, and I caused some questionable wipes on the newer dungeons that I could breeze through on my WHM.

Now I'm the type of person that will always apologize if I do something stupid, so perhaps that helps to defuse things within the party, but I do know personally sometimes people can just blank when in a new situation. I was being the bad healer in those instances as my reflexes just didn't kick in, much like the healers in the story above, but I would have been equally annoyed had I received some snarky replies over a mistake that was remedied on the next attempt.

And thats why i specifically mentioned pull 2 being the problem. You blank and we clear next pull no issue? I wont even remember the fight a day later to post on here unless something epically bad/funny happened. You blank, and apologize(which is also what i try to do if in a similar situation)? Ive typed "No worries, we'll get it this time" or "Thats ok, does anyone have any questions before we try this again?" so many times i should probly make a macro for it. Making the same mistake a second time without saying anything(then clearing easily after being called out) is where i sided with Maeka. And im not even defending the snarky comment(i try to keep those to myself), just saying i understand where its coming from and kinda agree. Ill also say on record that i dont know Maeka, and even though we're from the same server ive never noticed them in game before. So im not arguing for a friend, just someone whos point of view i understand.

[MoroMurasaki]

And I understand that, but again, half-dead raid and the remedy to such is universal to all duties.

The Chrysalis was actually the fight that made me quit the game for about six months. In retrospect it wasn't really the fight it's self but rather the players I got for it but still.

I don't know for sure if it's the first full party trial you participate in, it's definitely one of the first though. I was on WHM and was paired with an AST. This was a really long time ago so my boyfriend wasn't even tanking yet he was still a DRG.

The tanks we got along with the AST were just so awful to me and I didn't understand why. They kept yelling at me for us wiping because I didn't keep Medica II rolling all the time. Now I understand how completely stupid this is but back then I didn't know any better so I tried to listen to them (mostly so they would stop being mean to me) and wound up OOM by the time we got to the meteor phase.

Anyways, the fight ended up disbanding and it completely crushed my confidence. Even when I did come back six months later I was terrified to do any group content. I literally started at the Hall of the Novice (which had been introduced in my absence I think) and worked my way up through guildhests and dungeons.

My point is twofold - have sympathy for new people, even when they're causing wipes, especially around the introduction of a new kind of content. Prior to level 50 the only full party duty you have is that one last guildhest I believe. Participating in these things when all you've done prior is dungeoning is new and scary.

The other part is the lesson I learned - do your research. I enjoy patch day blind runs as much as the next person but expecting people to cater to your desire for a blind run (be it because you actually want a blind run or because you just didn't attempt to educate yourself) months or years after content is old is selfish. Watch or read a guide, most are only a few minutes of your time and could be the difference between a wipe and a clear. Your time is not inherently more valuable than anyone else's in that group and if there are seven of them who just want to get through this instance it is your responsibility to facilitate that to the best of your ability.

All that aside I have two stories brought to you by my alt character on Primal. She is mainly a PLD but I'm also leveling ACN to get to SCH/SMN (mostly SCH tbh) so she's in all sorts of shenanigans.

First off - got to use the Topaz Carbuncle to tank a reasonable portion of Copperbell. It wasn't easy. Our tank very well could have been a bot, I don't know, but he only used Fast Blade -> Savage Blade on one target until it died and didn't respond to anyone asking him to do otherwise. No rotating targets, no Flash. The healer also seemed overwhelmed when the damage was pinging everywhere (even though it was light) so I found myself healing my own Carbuncle. Basicallly, via pet, I tanked/healed/dpsed my way through the dungeon. Shoutout to my codps a lovely NIN who clearly shared my pain. She had Diversion up I swear on CD to make it easier on my bby Carbytank and he was thankful for it.

Then my tank story.

Er, well, my "I'm actually playing a tank" story.

I'm happy to have gotten to Brayflox. I actually have tank stance for the first dungeon ever. I have a returner DRG who is okayish I suppose, a sprout MCH who was my bestie in this run and a healer who was... bad. There are no other words. She was bad.

It's hard for me to know if anyone else is new at the start of these dungeons because the bonus message shows up no matter what since technically I am new. No one says anything (other than the mch responding to my greeting) so I move on.

I very nearly die on the first pull of two enemies because I don't get any healing. I double check to make sure I'm in tank stance (I am, I'm 32 so it didn't remove my stance when I got in because I didn't sync) and I used Rampart. My gear is all equipped.

Second pull, same thing. In the middle of the pull the healer summons their fairy. Oh yay, something to heal me! I have to drag the enemies closer to the healer to get healed though, they're too far away to actually hit me with auto embraces I guess.

This theme persists throughout the dungeon. On the final boss things get bad though - I die to a hit that I'm hesitant to call an actual 'tankbuster' but it hit for almost 400 damage. I also had two poison stacks.

I get a raise immediately - oh, so you know how to react quickly when I'm actually dead, huh?

Rinse and repeat - poison stacks all around, no esuna going out. The healer may as well have summoned Eos and gone afk. I die again. Before I can even say anything the MCH says "really?" in party chat. I'm inclined to agree, friendo.

I get back up again, MCH plays me Tactician (bless his heart, he played me Refresh the time before) and we manage to scrambled through.

How, when Eos is doing the bulk of your healing anyway, can one person be so bad? I know it wasn't on me - I played it safe and was in Shield Oath the entire time ,using Rampart/Awareness on CD. I suppose I could have swapped Provoke for Conva but then I would have had no way to take the boss back when I died.

Ugh. Just ugh. Healing, people! Please do it! I don't play this game to do all the work while you sit on your thumbs in a corner.

Edit: wow that's a novel. Sorry ppl ;-;

[Maeka]

Chrysalis is not the first Full Party you experience, nor anywhere near.

There's Cape Westwind.
There's the two MSQ Dungeons.
Moggle Mog.
Hard Primals (Ifrit/Titan/Garuda).
Ramuh.

And I think Leviathan even comes before Chrysalis but I'm not sure on that.

I'll look at my Trials list, because they're listed in the order you typically unlock them when I get on to do my dailies later.

[Frizze]

The Chrysalis was actually the fight that made me quit the game for about six months. In retrospect it wasn't really the fight it's self but rather the players I got for it but still.

I don't know for sure if it's the first full party trial you participate in, it's definitely one of the first though.

Definitely sorry to hear... all those stories. For Chrysalis in particular, if the other healer was on AST then my instinct is that they were(at least part of) the real problem. Sure, you might have made some new-player style mistakes, but being on AST means that they had been through all this, gotten to Ishgard at a minimum, and then leveled the new healer class up from 30. They would have to know the fight to get that far, and its very likely that they outgeared it by a good amount. In short, they should have been able to cover for a few minor screw-ups from the new person. Toss in the bad attitude and abusiveness toward the new player, and youre basically describing a garbage person. Also small correction, Chrysalis is actually toward the end of the 2.x series, so it ends up being the 9th full party trial you have to clear(and 11th instance if we count castrum and prae). Story-wise, it comes between Shiva(last of the elemental series) and Steps of Faith(end of the patch series) - so youve fought Cape Westwind, Mog, and all 6 elements prior to going in there(with another 14 optional trials available, plus 13 coils and 3 CT raids - not that most new people get into all that right away).