Either SMN and RDM should lose their Raise or BLM should get a Raise.

[PrismaticDaybreak]

Honesly I think a perfect if Verraise just had a 30 second recharge when Dualcasted. That way RDM has a noticeabe niche with White Magic skill but without being ou of hand.

[Llugen]

It is certainly not a crutch "by definition".

Resurrection may be labeled as a crutch when there is a sacrifice strategy being enacted (Manipulator's Royal Pentacle, Winged Justice's Compressed Water). At this point you are leaning on it to forego mechanics that are designed to be handled properly simply because it's easier to sac.

Characters dying is a very normal part of progression. This does not make it "a crutch", but favorable to bring as more potential for raising means more potential for moving further forward in the fight.

After progression, it's much more of a hindrance than a crutch. Losing uptime/resources/rotations is not "a crutch" but rather a gimp. You don't WANT players to die, but they do in fact die from time to time. The ability not to have to wipe a run because your only raiser (healer) or raisers die is not what I would call a crutch. This seems to be where our definitions differ.

[Galvuu]

Honesly I think a perfect if Verraise just had a 30 second recharge when Dualcasted. That way RDM has a noticeabe niche with White Magic skill but without being ou of hand.

I don't want to dilute a useful and unique niche RDM fills in progression.
Verraise is fine the way it is.
The issues with casters at large are only tangentially related to the raises- and I hope people can see this instead of calling for utility nerfs that don't fix the underlying issues.

[Cynfael]

It is certainly not a crutch "by definition".

Resurrection may be labeled as a crutch when there is a sacrifice strategy being enacted (Manipulator's Royal Pentacle, Winged Justice's Compressed Water). At this point you are leaning on it to forego mechanics that are designed to be handled properly simply because it's easier to sac.

Characters dying is a very normal part of progression. This does not make it "a crutch", but favorable to bring as more potential for raising means more potential for moving further forward in the fight.

After progression, it's much more of a hindrance than a crutch. Losing uptime/resources/rotations is not "a crutch" but rather a gimp. You don't WANT players to die, but they do in fact die from time to time. The ability not to have to wipe a run because your only raiser (healer) or raisers die is not what I would call a crutch. This seems to be where our definitions differ.

Resurrection allows you to proceed when fatal mistakes are made.

However, when no such mistakes are made, it is completely useless.

Its sole function is to enable recovery from errors. Of course you can call it what you like, but in my book this is a crutch.

Further, this is why the entire RDM Job is currently a progression clutch; groups lean on it to recover from multiple deaths and play further into each phase, then they are likely to shelve it once people stop dying so much.

[Remedi]

I don't want to dilute a useful and unique niche RDM fills in progression..

When that niche holds ransom the potential of a job too much it's however a bad niche that should go

[Galvuu]

When that niche holds ransom the potential of a job too much it's however a bad niche that should go

No, it really isn't, imho.
What do you mean by "holding ransom"? The fact RDM was (emphasis on was, because we all know they'll get swapped for a Summoner halfway through) a prime candidate for progression due to its unique ability to put a party back on its feet is good.
No other dps job could do that. Maybe it was the only unique thing it had, but it was a useful unique thing it had.
Do you mean "damage" by "potential"? As in, "they need to lower RDM's inherent dps because of the defensive utility it brings"? What's wrong with that? When was it in RDM's identity to do a ton of damage?
That's like saying "bard is help hostage by its insane utility". No, bard is just a high-utility, lower-dps job (and even then, does a lot of damage imho).

Or do you mean RDM holds another job ransom?
RDM and BLM are apples and oranges. They're not supposed to fight for the same kind of role, and they only do because of this ugly super-synergistic, super-overpowered physical comp (with a side of SMN).
The problem here isn't with RDM or Verraise. RDM also needs a bit of a bump to become more competitive- BRD, NIN and MCH all offer superior utility and superior personal dps.
The problem is how stacking casters is awful by party-synergy design and two of them are underpowered (BLM is straight trash).

*insert rant about how I believe BLM should be balanced to be a powerhouse in speedkilling/farming and not progressing because its playstyle inherently requires very deep knowledge of the fight that's non-conducive of optimal progression and counter-intuitive while you're learning a fight*

[Dualgunner]

snip

I agree with about 90% of this post; maybe all of it, as nothing is objectively wrong. I just dislike the idea of jobs being balanced for different portions of progression; it can lead to people who hate a job having to play it, and people who love a job having to leave it behind.

[Remedi]

Snip

You are not entirely wrong, but since some ppl have said that RDM cannot have a dmg upgrade because of the huge safety net they bring to the raid (which is as you said becoming less influential) I'd point my finger toward that uniquiness to be harmful
You use bard as a comparison, however Bard utility is always there while RDM usefulness gets lower and lower as you progress in an encounter, so they cannot really be compared and remember RDM total dmg is not higher than BLM even when rdps is factured.

In a world where chain ressing wouldn't be possible ppl would say that RDM is underpowerd but because ppl have become so compleced and drowsed by it because they seems, at least to me, to be mesmerized by the utility it provides they are simply ignoring a hidden problem.
Frankly the lack of empathy between jobs that the forum is displaying is discouraging and honestly it doesn't go in our favor. Anyway because the implementation of chain raising has started all this discussions of giving raise to BLM, which will lead eventually to some other jobs asking for it just like about everyone asks to get some sort of raid utility,I strongly believe that dualcast raise either should go or be extremely limited.

RDM was not implemented to be a Raise mage and since some of the ppl playing RDM dislike the moniker rez dispenser, I think it's very arrogant for ppl not playing it be aggresive towards them or telling them to stfu because they have an unwanted niche

As I said in the past, If we want to be taken seriously in ANY balance discussions the playerbase needs to be ready to even take steps against things that seems to be extremely useful if those things can lead to problems in the game eventually or are completely unintended

[Remedi]

As an addendum I'll add that WHM have a better niche of beign progression worthy since it emphasize raw power and efficency on their main role. I personally think they could do something like that for casters too so I don't understand why ppl like to defend verraise so much.
Why should we settle for small morsels when they have shown they can do much better?

[Llugen]

I just dislike the idea of jobs being balanced for different portions of progression; it can lead to people who hate a job having to play it, and people who love a job having to leave it behind.

The difference, though, is that no one actually "has" to leave RDM behind. It may be a weaker choice than SMN damage-wise, but it's not like anyone is upset about a RDM in their party. Sorry to turn this into another BLM comparison, but it's true. RDM is perfectly capable of doing the content and should only be buffed in relative proportion to BLM getting higher buffs. No one is going to coerce RDMs to play SMN with the same intensity that BLMs would be coerced to play either of the other two.

And yeah, I was certainly not happy with the state of "needing" to play RDM, and no one should be bullied into playing something when they don't want to. This is just another reason to have Raise on BLM; it should be able to compete in that arena with the other two jobs. Call me a broken record but it does not need to dispense infinite raises, it JUST needs to have the option to use it (better to have and not need than to need and not have). Give it a "raw power" twist, and call it a day.

"Raise this person to increase my damage? Hell to the yeah!" says every BLM main in the game. Problem solved.