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  1. #161
    Player
    Keridwyn's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    680
    Character
    Keridwyn Maeve
    World
    Coeurl
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Oaken View Post
    But thankfully, basic reasoning and antidotal observation are sufficient to prove the points in the OP.
    Basic reasoning also points to there being a hard cap on the amount of data a server can store and with Balmung's legendary population size a person can quite easily draw the conclusion you were running close to the point of instability.

    Secondly I am going to guess you meant anecdotal observation in which case your double standards are delicious. You cannot claim people are making fallacious arguements when your entire argument is based on evidence that is 'not necessarily true or reliable because it is based on personal account rather than research'.

    Happily willing to continue a polite debate as long as you realize you are arguing with passion not fact and that not everyone who disagrees is a 'troll'.
    (23)

  2. #162
    Player
    NanaWiloh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    2,458
    Character
    Nana Wiloh
    World
    Lamia
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Oaken View Post
    In response to the “lulz, u crazy, dude, where is ur evidence, SE knows everyting and hasn’t made mistake since 1.0, lulz” line of responses, I’ve edited the OP to address that issue:

    There is no reasonable basis for anyone to conclude that there is a population problem on Balmung at the present time. SE has presented no data or information about the current population level. Some posters are acting like SE has released concrete information that supports its decision. It has not, and in many instances SE has struggled to accurately report data or made inadvertent errors (i.e. – “FFXIV has surpasses 10 Million Players press release”; 1.0; Diadem, etc.). If you want to believe SE has correctly continued to lock the server, you need more information to reasonably conclude that at the present time. For example, it could state: “There are X active accounts on Balmung within the last 30 days. A FFXIV server can presently handle Y active accounts before server instability becomes a critical issue. Over the past 3 months, Z active accounts have transferred from the server. At this rate, the server will likely be unlocked in U months.” It is likely that SE may be keeping the server locked based on a metric like total number of characters (without taking into account active accounts). It is likely that SE does not understand the full extent of how the server lock is harming FCs, dividing the FFXIV RP community, and creating stagnation, which will ultimately lead to a loss of subscribers. The point of this thread is to point these issues out to SE and give people impacted by these issues a place to voice their concern.



    Thanks for your post. It poses several good questions. Short on time, so forgive typos and conclusory explanations.

    1. First off, on what grounds did you assume the right to speak for the Balmung's RP communities? (Yes, plural, communities. Balmung's RP groups split up into subsections like most other RP locale.)

    As much as any other member of the RP community. Most observations made in the OP are derived from the observable state of Balmung. There are no queues or server congestion issues at the present time. Without new players, FCs and groups are finding it increasingly difficult to find new members, and most are continuing the trend of turning inwards. Unfortunately, there are no empirical studies or concrete data. But thankfully, basic reasoning and antidotal observation are sufficient to prove the points in the OP. I’m fully aware advocating forcefully against a SE policy may annoy some in the community who have no vested interest in Balmung and simply enjoy trolling the forums to feel better about themselves. I usually avoid online forums for this reason (see post count). Ultimately, who cares? If SE even glances at this post (or another like it), and decides to at least release more information, it will be worth the minimal amount of time it has taken to draft.

    2. Did you truly think for more than yourself when making this thread. Are you aware of who you happen to be representing, intentionally or otherwise?

    Yes. I made the thread because the server lock is damaging the long-term viability of the FFXIV RP community and causing stagnation on Balmung. It would have been easier to do nothing. I’m well aware that some consider these types of posts pretentious and annoying. Again, who cares? The important thing here is that SE needs to understand that the server lock is harming the community, and players are aware of no valid reasons why the lock is in place. We have seen no data, heard no responses, or any type of concrete update on the issue. You seem intelligent enough to understand that an individual can never really speak for the community, and forming an opinion about an organization based on the personal views of one of its members is immature and stupid (and quite similar to how many RPers hold prejudicial views towards RPers). The RP community has been the subject of Kotaku posts about brothels and ERP. If this post is the tipping point that destroys its reputation, the risk was worth taking. There is nothing unreasonable about the points made in the OP, and one purpose of this forum is to alert the developers to potential issues with the game.

    The RP community should not embrace passive, defeatist attitudes and “live with what they have.” We are paying consumers and have every much as right to voice opinions about the game, especially when the size of the community likely exceeds other discrete sects of the community, like players seriously attempting ultimate raiding. You might be content to sit on your hands and hope for the best. Others are not.

    3. Have you considered the possibility of there being better, more fruitful efforts to invest your time?

    These posts take minimal time and effort. There are plenty of people making attempts to rally RPers and drum up RP. The absence of threads that address the consequences of the server lock and question the validity of SE's decision, however, is alarming. It possibly stems from the contentment many RPers feel with the status quo, and the fear of speaking out against the quo (as shown as the vitriol and trolling displayed in this thread). Creating plotlines and RP events does not address a systemic issue with the server itself: stagnation arising from an excessive and unneeded population control remedy.

    4. Have you considered the notion that it may ultimately be the Balmung Rp Community's Responsibility for its own health?

    Yes. That is why this post was drafted and many in the community work hard to support the community. It is unfortunate some members of the community adopt a passive approach to this issue, and forget that they have the ability to question unsound policies and advocate for reasonable changes to those policies. Instead of fearing that others will “beat up RPers” or “give people clubs to beat up Balmung,” it is better to address major problems and inequities head on. We’re all nerds playing a six-year old catgirl simulator, after all, and shouldn’t be concerned with others think of us. If the best thing a few forum lurkers can do is post juvenile memes and mock how someone thinks and types, it should be a sign that someone has a decent point. I’d explain more, but I can’t find anymore colorful words in my thesaurus to use. Sorry.
    Thank you for a more reasonable and less condsending post in comparison to the original. I want to adress one subject in your post and that is the need for more information from SE. Your asking a company too give information or data that could be harmful too their servers. There are security risks involved with releasing server info to the public, giving exact server caps for example while may seem innocent. To a person with the right knowledge and malicous intent it is a gold mine of information. If you want more information then you need tell them what exactly it is you want to see. just keep in mind they wont risk security just too calm the curiousity of disgruntled players. So you may or may not get what your seeking if you ask.
    (11)
    Last edited by NanaWiloh; 11-25-2017 at 07:27 AM.

  3. #163
    Player
    Mahrze's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    796
    Character
    Mahrze Crossner
    World
    Jenova
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Oaken View Post
    4. Have you considered the notion that it may ultimately be the Balmung Rp Community's Responsibility for its own health?

    Yes. That is why this post was drafted and many in the community work hard to support the community. It is unfortunate some members of the community adopt a passive approach to this issue, and forget that they have the ability to question unsound policies and advocate for reasonable changes to those policies. Instead of fearing that others will “beat up RPers” or “give people clubs to beat up Balmung,” it is better to address major problems and inequities head on. We’re all nerds playing a six-year old catgirl simulator, after all, and shouldn’t be concerned with others think of us. If the best thing a few forum lurkers can do is post juvenile memes and mock how someone thinks and types, it should be a sign that someone has a decent point. I’d explain more, but I can’t find anymore colorful words in my thesaurus to use. Sorry.

    Based on this post that I quoted and the sentence I underlined. It seems it really is a community effort (the RP community gathering together to see the issue and the possible solutions) vs SE trying to offer an equal experience across the board (Because you're not the only population in Balmung nor the only paying customers). Unofficial census sources point at Balmung being very overpopulated and the one server many people want to go to, and for that the RP community has put the noose on themselves.


    • Should the sever be unlocked? They (SE) will decide that with the data they have available. But with the RP community continuously trying to gather on one spot, lockdowns are something you can see happen.
    • Should there be an RP Server? Maybe, the bigger question is regarding people who do something more than RP in x server. I am sure people who RP do more than just that (OOC is the term used iirc) and they might not like moving elsewhere, so you have a conundrum where I am sure there's enough people in the RP community that have that same issue and as such, likely disagree with this, even with the datacenter FL and tell option.
    • Should I keep doing this? Of course you do, you have every right to express your opinion and concern, but as much as you seem to try to represent the community you're trying to be vocal for, you're just adding fuel to the flame that antagonizes you. We tend to get what we ask for, the issue is always the way we ask for it.
    (6)
    If you say so.

  4. #164
    Player
    Lazaruz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    128
    Character
    Sayo Nagae
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 70
    OP. As far as I'm concerned, consider yourself lucky that SE didnt consider it a necessary move to split Balmung down the middle into 2 servers.

    Also

    Quote Originally Posted by Oaken View Post
    If the best thing a few forum lurkers can do is post juvenile memes and mock how someone thinks and types, it should be a sign that someone has a decent point. I’d explain more, but I can’t find anymore colorful words in my thesaurus to use. Sorry.
    Thank you for proving that you did not even attempt to read my initial post in this thread.
    Now I know for sure that continuing this mockery of a debate is a complete and utter waste of my time
    (19)
    Last edited by Lazaruz; 11-25-2017 at 08:07 AM.

  5. #165
    Player
    Xerek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    262
    Character
    Alexandr Nocturne
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 70
    If the OP has time to make these replies, they have time to respond to those who disagree. They won't reply because they know they have no leg to stand on. So, they instead handwave and dismiss opposing viewpoints. As I noted before, you admonish (I know fancy words too) people who disagree for their blind loyalty to SE, yet you ask people for that exact same blind loyalty because you've yet to provide a shred of evidence. So, I need to accept SE at their word, or you at yours. Given SE has the server data and recently reopened Gilgamesh, I think I more trust them...especially since you have absolutely nothing concrete to base your assertions on, just a hunch that everything will be alright if the flood gates are opened.

    I understand the issue with server stagnation, but server limits are server limits, and a massive influx of new and returning playing causing queues and instability is not going to help Balmung. You can't fit ten pounds of players in a five pound bag, no matter how desperate you are. The power of faith and determination, strong though it may be, cannot overcome cold, hard mathmatics.
    (10)

  6. #166
    Player
    Kewitt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    1,358
    Character
    Ewitt Rainbow
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Fisher Lv 100
    Resolved by Community Making a new Official RP SERVER.. one of the preferred servers. There are a lot of people on Balmung that don't RP. Also there isn't an official RP server so all your RP arguments are void.

    Also there is active RP community on other servers.
    (4)
    Commendations.
    If I play dps I only give it out to other dps.
    If I play tank I only give it out to healers.
    If I play healer I only give it out to tank.

    Only if they should be getting a commendation.
    There are always exceptions to the rules!

  7. #167
    Player
    Xerek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    262
    Character
    Alexandr Nocturne
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Kewitt View Post
    Resolved by Community Making a new Official RP SERVER.. one of the preferred servers. There are a lot of people on Balmung that don't RP. Also there isn't an official RP server so all your RP arguments are void.

    Also there is active RP community on other servers.
    Already happened. Gilgamesh was the backup RP server, but it was also locked. So, the RP community settled on Matteus. A good number of RPers transferred from Balmung to Matteus as a result, and the population there exploded. Since SE ignored the call for official RP servers during the betas of XIV and ARR, they're stuck with situations like Balmung, where a large RP community is sharing a server with a good number of non-RPers, and Gilgamesh, which had the misfortune of being chosen as a secondary RP server the exact same time it was chosen as the home for the Reddit raiding community. Giving the RP community 2-3 servers back then would have prevented a number of population issues they've since run into, but what's done is done.
    (0)

  8. #168
    Player
    Hyrist's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Next to a dead Snurble.
    Posts
    1,969
    Character
    Lin Celistine
    World
    Goblin
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 90
    While I currently don't have time to go into a major retort of the core components of the counter-argument. Please be aware that there is player-created data parsing of our own population, which points out that Balmung still stays around the 20k active population range.

    And it's not just queues currently we have to worry about, it's queues during our most peak times - which is Expansion releases and even number patch releases. Stromblood was far and away more of a struggle than Heavensward, and we can anticipate that future expansions may result similarly.

    Given Greg's Server was changed to normal, we should obsreve that there is about a 4-5k active player difference between the two. There's the goal marker SE has set. Queue times only mark how many players are logging in at once, which does not show congestion times during peak activity.

    The fact that Balmung was labeled the unofficial RP server is also a concern. They likely want other RP communities to be established on other servers and root there before unlocking Balmung and directly causing a large influx.

    In the end, I maintain that Balmumg is ultimately responsible for maintaining Balmung's RP community regardless of what state it is in - and that the thread (and owners) execution, not intention did more to harm the community then assist it.

    As far as Kotaku's articles - well, someone needed some easy clicks and likes FFXIV. That's about it. That did nothing to damage the RP community as most RPers ignore those rumors anyways.
    (5)
    Last edited by Hyrist; 11-26-2017 at 02:25 PM.

  9. #169
    Player
    Soupa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    261
    Character
    Soupa Eptco
    World
    Coeurl
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 80
    Dude just wait for the restrictions to be lifted. Gilgamesh's just did, you can't be that far behind. As as for the constant argument of "muh community is less populated/dying." Thats. The. Point. Of. The. Lock. As heartless as it sounds SE has to maintain their servers and actually make it so people can play on them, as for the whole "Oh large populations don't affect server stability and have absolutely no downsides. That's fake news fed to us by the corporate overlords." This realm of thinking is illogical, irrational, and completely self-centered on the needs of one group of players rather then all of them. I don't even check the forums regularly and I know this isn't even your first thread about this.
    (4)

  10. #170
    Player
    Nyxn607's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    269
    Character
    Hypnotic Noodle
    World
    Coeurl
    Main Class
    Dancer Lv 83
    This topic needs to die. The locked server will be unlocked when the population has reached a point SE feels is appropriate. Whether you agree with it or not, the choice is not yours to unlock/lock it. You can help by leaving the congested server though as the other people have stated. Until I see your data backing up your claims, you are no better than SE is at this point. Show the data or shut up.
    (5)
    "If you walk through life thinking you are not needed, remember that there is always someone that is counting on you." -CP

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