So are we *ever* getting the planned list of Class/Ability changes?

[Sephrick]

They're nearly two weeks overdue from when you originally promised them, and if you're planning to release them so close to the tentative patch release date, you will not have the time to consider player feedback of your planned significant changes.

The playerbase has gone an extremely long time now without any REAL information. For most MMO's, I would say things like timely patch notes are a privilege and not a right. However, given that you plan to start charging us for this product next month and we still have no idea exactly what new content/changes are being planned for 1.20, we should have already had these patch notes.

Communicating these ideas with us should be your second highest priority behind actually developing the game. At this rate, we'll have the class change list in our hands for a week before the patch itself, and that's unacceptable.

Actually, they said they'd be released when 1.19 went live, so they're months over due. If future 1.x content is going to be designed like Ifrit where high level abilities are required to survive an attack, I'd like to get started on obtaining key abilities now.

I certainly hope tomorrow is the day. But SE has proved true that they have a generous definition of "soon."

[Bahn]

Anytime before December 15th could be classified as the "first" part of December since it's technically before "Mid Month." Businesses release a tentative schedule for a reason. If they know they can't release something by the first part of that schedule, they still have time to make the "deadline" due to the freedom such a schedule gives.

It'll get released when it's ready to be. Plenty of other good games out at the moment. You don't have to be playing FF14. I'd like to be playing 1.20 as much as everyone else, I just have other things to occupy my time until that day arrives.

I would like to again point back to Ronik's key issues. The problem with these tentative dates is that we still don't know, with less than a month remaining, when 1.20 will come out relative to when it goes P2P. The later they delay the notes and the longer they take to program the class changes, the less time they could have to get feedback from the community about it.

I'm pretty sure they're capable of saving a lot of time and headaches (and tl;dr forum posts) for both them and us if they list what they're going to change now so they'd have more than enough time to take our player feedback and implement it into the final 1.20, instead of implementing fixes to undo the possible damage that 1.20 might have done *after* it is released.

But I do agree, there are other games to play - SWTOR is right around the corner and I believe they're doing another beta test weekend in a couple of weeks, and lots of great games came out in the past few weeks, so definitely you have a point there.

[Firon]

Class info gonna be out tomorrow, so they can read everyone's usual bitching and moaning thru out the weekend.

[NadienKirisame]

Class info gonna be out tomorrow, so they can read everyone's usual bitching and moaning thru out the weekend.

And that is probably the issue. The sent out the first notes and as the forums was blowing up of people not understanding and unable to figure things out. So they looked at the second part and thought hmmm maybe we should look this over more and see if we can make it more understandable... just then one of the guys posts the armor dye changes which causes more misunderstanding and threads popping up not know what is going on. So they look at the second part again and think hmmm maybe we should rewrite it again so its even more understandable so the people on the forums get it.

And thus time passes and days turn into week and weeks into months... and the seasons change from fall into winter... and winter gives way into spring and spring changes into summer... and summer skips right over fall and goes into winter and they were forced to eat Robins minstrels...

No but really you get it right... /sigh

The cat is bemused =-.-=

[OMEGA_HACK]

My thoughts:

Major changes (changes to game play algorithms, skill removal/adding, changes to spells/abilities functions, changes to recipes):
Should be announced as a collective whole at least two weeks prior to the patch update

Minor changes (new dungeons, aesthetic changes to the world/cities/dungeons/players, new dye colors, new items, new minigames (ie: Chocobo breeding/racing, housing and the like):
Should be announced on the day of at the very least two days prior to the patch update

Rolling Information (Generic non-detailed information)
On a weekly basis, nothing in detail like the above two patch notes should be, could be very general as in "Look forward to this new XYZ Dungeon! More in later update notes!" stuff along that line...teasers I should say.

The first two types of information need to be VERY DETAILED (and I don't mean how to clear the dungeon detailed, I'm not looking for a strategy guide) but detailed in the sense of there should be very little room for confusion (which happens all the time it seems on these forums with the information they release) Also if I was the person making these notes I would suggest to my boss to stop using "Early/Mid/Late XXX Month" phrases, instead ask "What is the time frame in which we wish to release this patch?" and from that give a more detailed date so it could read something like

"Expect this new dungeon to go live sometime between November 15th and December 10th!*"
*If any delays are incurred players will be notified via lodestone."

That way you remove a lot of the doom speakers, because they form on the lack of concise information, it is a really simple fix, Square-Enix, its time to be a little less translucent (at least your not fully opaque anymore!)

[Quisi]

I tought it was obvious they won't bother with fan feedback before we try patch 1.20.

[neizero]

At this rate, we'll have the class change list in our hands for a week before the patch itself, and that's unacceptable.

At this point, I would prefer they give us whatever they have come up with and "forget" about player feedback for now, rather than starting the snowball of patch delays that will put 2.0 sometime in 2013...

[Viridiana]

Class reforms part 1 was posted on the 11th. The stuff they didn't post related directly to what's being rebalanced and shuffled around, which obviously means it will take more time to finalize in terms of presentation because they could write off all the changes, but find out that something wasn't properly tested or they flubbed on saving the data and have to retract their statement.

I think the problem with this whole situation is Yoshida saying he doesn't want to post info on anything unless he's absolutely sure, yet people complained about Tanaka posting info and things always end up being different or we got "lied to."

Considering they said we'd have it when 1.19 went live, it's been a while. . .

[RolandDebreton]

I'm amazed at the entitled attitude of so many of the players. Do any of you actually work for a business, do you understand how these things work? To demand, and say that something is, "unacceptable?" when you haven't paid so much as a penny!

I have worked for and managed a few different types of businesses. Here is a newsflash: The customer isn't always right, and believing such is an asinine point of view. Sometimes a customer has no viable right to information, sometimes they wouldn't know what to do with it, sometimes a company simply isn't ready to give it.

Do you think Tempur-Pedic is ever going to tell you what's in that foam? Do you think you will ever know what special sauce McDonald's uses or Coca-Cola is? Do you think Apple is going to divulge info on the iPhone 5 or 6 or whatever they are up to before they are ready to divulge? How about Hollywood? They going to divulge script info or endings?

Are you ready for that info? No. Unacceptable is this imbecilic attitude that you are owed something, heck, anything. Even when a paying customer, do you know what they owe you? Jack, they don't have to give you anything.

Incidentally, as far as the, "customer is always right," in a business that sells an environment or an experience there is a largely unknown formula. Its called addition by subtraction. Basically, businesses that sell these events or environs know that there are some customers that are so undesirable, or unpleasant, or that simply make doing the job so untenable that not having them is actually better for business than having them would be. Maybe people need to learn to be better customers, and quit making meaningless demands.

[goonMagi]

Has it been confirmed that 1.20 will begin pay to play services? I was under the impression that 1.20 would come out, as well as some jobs, before pay to play which would have been closer to march 2012. Maybe I read the road map incorrectly..

please confirm/deny