Dark Knight Tank Stance Change +3.x Reprisal and 3.x Dark Dance

[Chrono_Rising]

That's why I deleted my message, since you posted your results while I was busy writing it

Yet the initial Delirum comment still stands. Spending Blood and MP to gain more Blood and MP is weird. It's best to make the skill free but its effect weaker.

I am also fine with this. I removed it from the OP, it is only a 4.4 potency transfer anyway.

[Mycow8me]

I don't see why we would need to nerf the resource gain, care to elaborate? Full time blood weapon when not in grit gives us a competitive dps placing us between pld and warrior on its own as an off tank, lowering this just makes us less competitive.

I did the math in a another thread, but my aim is to raise us up to near warrior levels. We need a potency per second change of around 17 to 19 to be in the same ballpark, this change to blood weapon is on the high end, but in the correct ballpark.

I didnt math it out cause math is not my forte especially potency calculations, but my gut feeling told me it would be too powerful. I can handle basic math. Were around 10 physical gcds for every 50 blood not including auto attacks or a plunge so closer to 8 or even 6 gcds for every blood spiller (that includes 2 souleaters) if blood gains are not lowered. Not to mention quietus spam will be very heavy with current bloodgains and full uptime unless were not considering dungeon or adds content. That just felt OP to me but if we are trying to achieve war's dps, I probably cant get a feel for that not using math.

[Chrono_Rising]

I didnt math it out cause math is not my forte especially potency calculations, but my gut feeling told me it would be too powerful. I can handle basic math. Were around 10 physical gcds for every 50 blood not including auto attacks or a plunge so closer to 8 or even 6 gcds for every blood spiller (that includes 2 souleaters) if blood gains are not lowered. Not to mention quietus spam will be very heavy with current bloodgains and full uptime unless were not considering dungeon or adds content. That just felt OP to me but if we are trying to achieve war's dps, I probably cant get a feel for that not using math.

Fair, providing some analysis: Blood weapon nets us about 450 potency per use in the form of mana and blood, or 30 potency a second for its duration of 15 seconds.

To see the effective change we multiply this by the change in uptime between its current maximum theoretical uptime of 68/120 and my proposed uptime of 1.

Potency per second change: 30(1-68/120) = 13 (this is above paladin but less than warrior, it is surprising but yes this is exactly 13)

Adding back Reprisal will net us a maximum of 7 potency per second, bring our change to about 20 potency per second change.

[Mycow8me]

Well reprisal would be a perfect scenario of maximum use on cooldown which will probably not happen. Thanks for the calculation though, I guess ultimately we are aiming to be as close to wars dps as possible? Ironically with all the recent talks of utility vs dps balancing we should be higher than warrior in terms of dps due to how our utility skill works... I have a feeling that would cause a uproar though.

Edit: Mostly because our utility skill is a single target and our fluff utility may not be possible for certain powerful attacks where boss is not targetable anyway.

[Chrono_Rising]

Right, but with both changes this puts us a head of warrior precisely because our utilities are weaker.

[Mycow8me]

I'm curious as to how auto attacks was worked into bloodweapons potency equations and even more curious how it would effect us with full uptime.

Edit: nevermind, I just hit a dummy for a while it seems like auto attack is roughly a 100 potency hit. With 10% faster attack speed its basically just an assumed 110 potency during bloodweapon from auto attacks I'm guessing? This is why math is not my forte.

[Chrono_Rising]

I'm curious as to how auto attacks was worked into bloodweapons potency equations and even more curious how it would effect us with full uptime.

Edit: nevermind, I just hit a dummy for a while it seems like auto attack is roughly a 100 potency hit. With 10% faster attack speed its basically just an assumed 110 potency during bloodweapon from auto attacks I'm guessing? This is why math is not my forte.

Thank you for looking so closely into this. Yes, the faster attack speed is another question. In general, the effect of attack speed varies greatly with fights, and its rewards can be diminished in fights with multiple phase transitions where enemies cannot be targeted. It also has a feedback effect into blood weapon since the higher attack speed also helps to generate more resources.

Our net potency per second at a GCD of 2.45 is given by (770/(3*2.45)+110/3) = 141.4 potency per second, note this is dependent on our GCD. Speeding this up by 10% will result in a potency per second of about 15.71.

The net change due to skill speed of full time blood weapon is given by: 15.71(1-68/120) = 6.81 potency per second.

I won't lie, this is a little higher than I was expecting, and some tweaking to reprisal or delirium may be needed.

[Reynhart]

With 10% faster attack speed its basically just an assumed 110 potency during bloodweapon from auto attacks I'm guessing?

Not exactly but as such low values, it doesn't make a real difference. Haste effect exponentialy increases damage, that's why Skill speed and Spell speed have such low effect.

[Mycow8me]

Not exactly but as such low values, it doesn't make a real difference. Haste effect exponentialy increases damage, that's why Skill speed and Spell speed have such low effect.

It doesn't make a real difference in very small windows. If we are talking full uptime, that is a huge difference in comparison. This probably needs evaluation if you are trying to keep DPS at a certain point.

Edit: To get even more technical, you have more chances to crit/direct the duration you have it up as well. This is why I find turning these scenarios into a math equation so difficult for anything other than estimating.

[Xenosan]

I could see Blood Weapon and Blood Price maintained for 100% uptime similar to Blood/Life of the Dragon via Delirium, Bloodspiller, and Quietus.

or both allowed with/without Grit to allow DRK to rotate them for 100% uptime (combined) like a Bard rotates Ballad/Peon/Minuet.

or Delirium providing a 20-30 second buff like Dreadwyrm Trance, replacing some actions with buffed alternatives, like changing Price/Weapon (whichever one your locked out of based on your whether you're in Grit or not) into a skill that can be used in either..

But that's all not very likely to happen, and would still need additional tweaks to get some of the mentioned skills in a better place.