SAM: anything you would add/remove for 5.0?

[ErzaScarlet77]

i think it plays perfectly fine, but i want better aesthetic, cooler looking skills and stuff. most of sam skills look kinda bland. def yukikaze needs a cooler effect imo. the hissatsu skills could also get some flashiness.

i know not everyone likes auras, but i do and man, itd be cool if sam gets some sort of aura

and SAM lb3 is probably the lamest lookign of all the melee dps. most of the time you cant even tell its happening compared to giant blue dragon, giant floating ritual swords, and giant pillar of light


gameplay wise, does anyone even use hissatsu seigan in any serious content?

[wereotter]

This is true of all the melee jobs, but especially true of samurai. We NEED an agro dump. Diversion simply isn't good enough for the amount of agro we generate. I could see this implemented as part of a comb of skills not unlike the Red Mage Corps-a-Corps/Displacement ability

Samurai uses Yanten to backstep for damage + agro dump, have that combo into Enpi like it already does, then use Gyoten to get back on the boss.

And to your second question, I have used Seigan in O2s, but not sure if it's worth it or not. Generally I will use Third Eye during the stack mechanics to trigger it, but it does feel like it's a bit of a waste of an OGCD to use it. It's a skill that, given the hoop you have to jump through to trigger it, should have a higher potency than Shinten, and maybe have its Kenki cost raised to be the same as Shinto.

Edit: Also, extend the duration of the Third Eye shield. 3 seconds is WAY too short to actually be able to use it to mitigate party-wide damage. Similar skills from other jobs last for 20 seconds.

[SpeckledBurd]

This is true of all the melee jobs, but especially true of samurai. We NEED an agro dump. Diversion simply isn't good enough for the amount of agro we generate. I could see this implemented as part of a comb of skills not unlike the Red Mage Corps-a-Corps/Displacement ability

Samurai uses Yanten to backstep for damage + agro dump, have that combo into Enpi like it already does, then use Gyoten to get back on the boss.

Frankly, they should just make Invigorate have an aggro 1/2 effect like basically every other resource regenerating skill has. Refresh, Tactician, and Lucid Dreaming all have that as an effect, it's kind of odd that invigorate doesn't.

Seigen also does have higher potency per Kenki than Shinten, not by much, but if you're willing to go through the effort of proccing it its DPS gain (if a very minor one).

[Kahnom]

Stuffs

5 sec third eye would be awesome and that's all I need for the current SAM.
About aggro though,it should be fine as long as you use Diversion everytime its up.
But if the MT plans to stay in attack stance the whole run in PUG not with their static then its on them.
More aggro dump skills will never be a bad thing but I don't think any SAM in PUG gonna use it anyway.

[mosaicex]

I think Third Eye's 3 seconds duration is fine for how short the cooldown is.
Seigan definitely could use potency/kenki adjustment though, something like 330 or 340 potency for 25 Kenki same as Shinten, making it feels more rewarding.

[wereotter]

I think Third Eye's 3 seconds duration is fine for how short the cooldown is.
Seigan definitely could use potency/kenki adjustment though, something like 330 or 340 potency for 25 Kenki same as Shinten, making it feels more rewarding.

Problem as it currently is comes downto needing impeccable timing in order to get it right. You not only have to get the buff on, you have to also get the server to register the buff before the damage hits you, giving you very little margin of error to get it to trigger. In O2s, half the time I end up with either having the buff fall off before I take the raid-wide damage, or the buff doesn't register in time, and in either case, I don't get the Open Eyes proc. Extending the buff to 5-7 seconds gives a little more leeway to use it during stack mechanics and the like.

5 sec third eye would be awesome and that's all I need for the current SAM.
About aggro though,it should be fine as long as you use Diversion everytime its up.
But if the MT plans to stay in attack stance the whole run in PUG not with their static then its on them.
More aggro dump skills will never be a bad thing but I don't think any SAM in PUG gonna use it anyway.

This may be true, but I'm thinking of situations like in O3s, my group has needed me to save Diversion for adds like popping it before attacking White Flame, Iron Giant, and Apanda, so I don't get to get that benefit on Halicarnassus. And as we have no ninja, it means tanks have to spend more time in tank stance and spend more agro combos. Also the argument can be made that the skills are backwards. Ranged jobs are more burst heavy, and so could make more use of diversion, which Bard and Machinist don't get, while melee jobs are more sustained, meaning they ought to have the agro dump that they're currently lacking.

Frankly, they should just make Invigorate have an aggro 1/2 effect like basically every other resource regenerating skill has. Refresh, Tactician, and Lucid Dreaming all have that as an effect, it's kind of odd that invigorate doesn't.

Seigen also does have higher potency per Kenki than Shinten, not by much, but if you're willing to go through the effort of proccing it its DPS gain (if a very minor one).

Attaching an agro dump to Invigorate is a pretty good idea! My only worry would be that I tend to save Invigorate in case of death, at which point all your agro is gone anyway... however it's possible that now it's not such a big deal to need the TP after raising. I'll have to check that.

[mosaicex]

Problem as it currently is comes downto needing impeccable timing in order to get it right. You not only have to get the buff on, you have to also get the server to register the buff before the damage hits you, giving you very little margin of error to get it to trigger. In O2s, half the time I end up with either having the buff fall off before I take the raid-wide damage, or the buff doesn't register in time, and in either case, I don't get the Open Eyes proc. Extending the buff to 5-7 seconds gives a little more leeway to use it during stack mechanics and the like.

I never have any particular problem with the timing but I understand what you mean. I'm already used to anticipating raid wide aoe damage in general (to deal with using Reprisal, TBN, etc. which has longer duration but much more punishing if you missed), even thing like Gravity Manipulation or Unstable Gravity stack in 2s. Just my opinion but I think 3 seconds is pretty generous considering most raid wide aoes with cast bar usually come in 2.5 or 5 seconds increment.
That said, wouldn't hurt if they increase it to 4 or 5 seconds though, but I think they want to keep that high risk feeling like when you parry/counter from other type of games.

[SwarleyMcSwarls]

gameplay wise, does anyone even use hissatsu seigan in any serious content?

People SHOULD. You net more potency per kenki with seigan than shinten. So any time you can get a third eye proc to use it you should be doing so. With that said, I would like to see more reward from correctly using third eye and getting that interaction to further distance efficient and well-practiced samurais from others. But I'm fine with how it is working and functioning. Going with that theme of efficiency, I'd like to see more quirks for efficiency as a Samurai. Because it's fairly accessible for a dps and with how well it performs in content I'd like to see a higher skill ceiling with the job to really make that high dps feel rewarding.

Beyond that, I agree with what other people are saying about samurai needing more aggro dump. Especially when you compare it to other jobs that generate less aggro but have more tools for dropping enmity like Nin and Drg.

[RenOkamiya]

Frankly, they should just make Invigorate have an aggro 1/2 effect like basically every other resource regenerating skill has. Refresh, Tactician, and Lucid Dreaming all have that as an effect, it's kind of odd that invigorate doesn't..

If they did that, they would have to rework diversion since it would be useless, it's not like you need TP anyway at a start of a fight or at any moment if you don't AOE/die so... It will be a complete replacement of a role skill. Since they don't seem to have the best ideas in this department, I don't think we are gonna see this any moment soon ^^

[Dzian]

: Also, extend the duration of the Third Eye shield. 3 seconds is WAY too short to actually be able to use it to mitigate party-wide damage. Similar skills from other jobs last for 20 seconds.

This is probably the main thing I'd want to change. The duration simply isn't long enough for the most part. Especially with some of the long ass animations on some of those stack mechanics. Where you can't act or press anything for a good 10 seconds so making use of seigan is impossible.

And maybe reduce the Cool down on agatha a bit. Some of those low hp moves have quite lengthy cooldowns. Should be more in line with misery ends cooldown at least makes it more worth a slot on the action bar

I'd also tweak their aoe a little. Make the fuga a conal aoe instead of a circular.
Just because imo it doesn't make much sense having fuga as a circular and the both mangetsu and oka are conal attacks
it just Isn't very fluid