[Suggestion to Yoshida and the com] Third Dragoon alternative

[Loggos]

Okaaay, I really hope you're not gonna kill me because I'm opening this thread although there are several others featuring the Dragoon discussion. I don't do that because I think I'm oh so great and my idea must be liked by everyone.
But regarding the fact that the Dragoon discussion is quite big with two strongly wishing parties I think or hope that my idea might be a compromise that satisfies both sides.
This is why I want to gather your votes so to speak officially once more because – believe me or not – this issue is killing my sleep.

(And if you do want to kill me...well luckily you don't know where I live...o.o' but please, I really don't want to cause a fight with this. I just need to write it down, otherwise my mind's probably gonna pop...)


Please read through this post and if you like the basic idea please like the post.
(I'll state a lot of suggestions, just so that you can imagine what my idea could look like ingame. For this reason all those things are just my examples and hence not the basic idea that is to be decided about!)


The idea that I have also already posted in the other DRG thread and to that I added ideas from other people's comments is the following one:


A Dragoon that is efficient with and without dragon and that can be played with and without dragon.

Patch 1.20 will bring the job, right? And it will most likely not feature a dragon but imo this is ok.
Because I think first the Dragoon should be implemented in the game and made stable by SE before anything like a dragon could even be added at all.

The dragon could be gained after 2.0 then through a quest, meaning, if you don't want the dragon, you just leave this quest out.


So, why having a dragon at all?

It could be more than just decoration or a Pokemon clone but a valid partner of the dragon knight that can be called when needed (and be sent away anytime, too).
The dragon should be an active part of the fighting, like a team member, just one that doesn't take away any other member's space.


Why two kinds of a Dragoon?

I do not want to suggest to have two kinds of dragoon because like pointed out before it would take the definite character of the dragoon away.
This is why I sugges to see the Dragoon as some kind of dragon knight/dragon rider that possesses his own dragon-like powers and serves as a crit. DD, but that can when desired call an auxiliary.
This means, you can decide.

If you don't want the dragon send it to hell and be the Dragoon with dragon skills like fire breath, jump etc. (I'd love to have those skills and wouldn't mind cool animations of them at all).

But since there are also those that do like to have a dragon with them, it would be an alternative for both.
And I think looking at the Dragoon as a dragon knight with an occasional comrade it would still be one straightly structured class imo.


I see, and the balance?

As Yoshida said, it might be a bit difficult to balance the Dragoon then. Hence my idea to debuff the DRG as long as the dragon takes part in the fight so that summed up they have the same efficiency as the solo DRG.
But then the dragon must be so useful that people are prepared to be debuffed, otherwise the whole thing would be pretty senseless.

So there was this thought: Dragons are like team members, that complement the Dragoon.
They could be of different „types“, resempling different classes.

E.G.
A physical DD
An elemental DD
A tank with buffs
A kind of „thief“ with poisons, DoTs, debuffs etc.

The first advantage in general is that two fight at the same time without leeching the player's exp and if the mob to be fought doesn't turn out as an AoEer only one can recieve damage, the other one stays unaffected.
So, the dragon is supposed to be so efficient that the dragoon's weakened attributes are compensated!
And this weakened state would ony last as long as the dragon is summoned.
This means: If it dies, you are not useless but again the „old“ strong Dragoon.


Further ideas and possibilities

If possible the dragon could be used as mount, e.g. also if you don't like a fighting partner you could still make use of the dragon. (If „air battles“ were possible someday?...but that's another topic.)

The dragon could, like equip, grow emotionally close to the player, enabling special combos or „sacrifications“ (meaning the dragon sacrifices some of its life for yours or even dies for you when you would actually have been killed.)

I also think that the normal healing spells and buffs should work with the dragon so that no new skills would need to be implemented (but that's plain detail).

In respect of the story, it could be told that way: Since there seems to be dragons' blood in the Dragoons they could be able to gain the respect of the otherwise feared dragons (this could also be part of the quest to gain the dragon) and win it as a partner this way.
The Dragoons themself are and stay the wellknown fighters though.


Yes, I'm posting that stupid picture again. It is just for the sake of explaination because imo it shows what I want to say pretty well. ._. *don't kill me*




In conclusion:

Those suggestion are related to the time of 2.0 and beyond.

The Dragoon shall stay the way he is ---> a strong DD based upon dragons (also desirably with such skills)

The dragon can be called for help but that's free choice. If called the Dragoon must be weakened a bit for the sake of balance, therefore the dragon has some real use that compensates this state.

Everybody can play the Dragoon the way he wants to and is no useless class for the community.
The dragon is rather supposed to be additional/an add-on, that is implemented later, used to complement the dragoon and not completely destroy or change it.


If you think, this is a possibility to satisfy both parties and would therefore like to have it ingame, please „like“ the post.
It doesn't matter at all if you play with or without dragon in the end. If you like the basic idea and think it could help both sides I'd be more than happy if you guys supported it.

[Loggos]

Please like this post if you are against the idea.

[RemVye]

Pretty sure this has already been suggested... like 5 times \0\ /0/

[Dreadnought]

it essentially sounds like "let us choose if we want our own wyvern pet or not so everyone will be happy". the same as "let us turn off agro meters"

it not only sounds generic imo, but you also have to remember that balancing isnt an easy issue and not done over night. having a system for one class and one class only that allows its stats to bounce back and forth according to whether or not that person chooses to have a wyvern at that time would be an annoying and arduous feat.... especially for only one class.
im sure other classes would like the special treatment one way or another as well.

this please all mentality does not work very well.

[Geesus]

This is similar to how it was in XI. You didn't HAVE to have your pet you called him. Same with Summoner; Carby and others were called upon. The Wyvern (not dragon btw ) was called upon and stayed until killed. Depending on the sub job of the Dragoon themselves, gave their pet some abilities. Example, if subbing Whm then Wyvern would have healing breath.

Edit: Now before you could just call your Wyvern at whim it USE to be what's known for all the non XI players as a 2 hour ability; they could do something similar here in XIV. This way calling your pet would be the "OH SHIT" moment only need not a consistent "partner" and slot filler in a PT.

[Loggos]

@ Geesus

Ah, I see! I haven't played FFXI but from all what I have read it sounded like the wyvern wasn't that effective, especially if dead the dragoon lacked of power.

@ Dreadnought

I see your point and I DO think it is difficult but I don't think that it is as drastic as you say. But again I'm not into fighting, it's just how I see things.
Of course balance is an important issue but I'm not calling for this option now but for like...more than a year? I am positive that until a wyvern might be released the developers will have worked out a balance because till then also the dragoon should be balanced.
Besides what I thought of was like a debuff. When you get downgraded ingame your stats are bouncing too. Basically with all the effects in fights stats are bouncing temporarily. So imo it could also be possible to use the dragon as a "debuff".
I don't really consider it annoying but that's personal. Of course I'd prefer not to be downgraded at all but that would really imbalance the Dragoon so the downgrade would be a makeshift.
What I agree about though is the thing with the other classe's special treatment.
But again, I didn't make this thread (with obviously already stated ideas, sorry for that) to convince everybody to love wyverns but to vote for an alternative, so that both sides can play the way they want to, though I don't really agree with your comparison but hey, that's just my view.
Keep in mind, it's just a suggestion, I don't think it is the holy grail of FF14 but it is still my concern to have it posted.



@ RemVye

Didn't know that. :P

[Dreadnought]

This is similar to how it was in XI. You didn't HAVE to have your pet you called him. Same with Summoner; Carby and others were called upon. The Wyvern (not dragon btw ) was called upon and stayed until killed. Depending on the sub job of the Dragoon themselves, gave their pet some abilities. Example, if subbing Whm then Wyvern would have healing breath.

Edit: Now before you could just call your Wyvern at whim it USE to be what's known for all the non XI players as a 2 hour ability; they could do something similar here in XIV. This way calling your pet would be the "OH SHIT" moment only need not a consistent "partner" and slot filler in a PT.

the difference is no ones stats changed on whether or not the pet was called. if your wyvern died then you were gimped, if carby died you needed to get the hell out of there lol

[Corrderio]

I wonder if Yoshida regrets ever mentioning the wyvren thing...

[OriginalHungerforce]

Patch 1.20 will bring the job, right?

no.... 1.21

[Cichy]

When they implement pets, there should be a dragon pet and that's about it. Class should be balanced as if the pet doesnt exist.