Dear Healers who don't DPS

[RulerOfPotaoes]

People don't seem to understand that the healer (the player) is self aware and capable of dps'n... it is (Not) mandatory.. it is (Not) obligatory to dps as a healer.

you do not demand or criticize the healer for not dps'n because for all you know the (Healer/Player) is just not feeling like dps'n for whatever reason.. and is probably better than you or what you give him credit for.

Not having to dps as a healer because its (not) mandatory is one of the few luxuries healers have for having the most stressful role in the game.

Ask nicely if your healer is willing to dps. If he says no then deal with it and keep in mind the things i mentioned above.

[Taika]

People don't seem to understand that the healer (the player) is self aware and capable of dps'n... it is (Not) mandatory.. it is (Not) obligatory to dps as a healer.

On the contrary: what most people do seem to understand pretty well is that when you're playing in a team and you can do something that's good and helpful for your team, you should do it.

you do not demand or criticize the healer for not dps'n because for all you know the (Healer/Player) is just not feeling like dps'n for whatever reason.. and is probably better than you or what you give him credit for.

What if the BLM just isn't feeling like using their fire spells? What if the PLD isn't feeling like doing any DPS? What if the BRD isn't feeling like giving their party members MP/TP when that's needed? It's one thing if you have a reason for not doing something ("sorry I have a horrible headache and I'm just trying to get through this by focusing on only healing / my most basic rotation / keeping hate"), but "I'm just not feeling like being helpful to my party" is not something anyone should get much credit for.

Not having to dps as a healer because its (not) mandatory is one of the few luxuries healers have for having the most stressful role in the game.

Most stressful role, really? In a few specific fights (which have nothing to do with DF) maybe. In general, definitely not (yes I mained healer from 1.0 until early SB).

Ask nicely if your healer is willing to dps. If he says no then deal with it and keep in mind the things i mentioned above.

I will ask nicely. If he refuses to co-operate (without a reason when there's clearly an opportunity for it), I will ask nicely again, and explain why they should. If they still refuse to co-operate, that's what the playstyle differences vote kick is for.

[RulerOfPotaoes]

You don't understand that (Should) and (Has) to dps are two different things. Nobody is arguing wether a healer should dps or not. This long year issue is whether the healer Has to or not.

Dps has to do damage
Tank has to keep agroo
Healer has to keep the team alive.

A healer should dps yes but he's not forced or obligated to because (Should) and (has) are two different things. Most healers understand this and only dps when they want to and not because people think they (should)

[Taika]

You don't understand that (Should) and (Has) to dps are two different things.

No one has to do anything in this game. But other players also don't have to play with a player who's choosing to hold their group back.

[Deceptus]

Tank has to keep agroo

It has been shown that a tank CAN keep aggro by doing extremely LITTLE dps.

But if a tank did that, they'd be shunned.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Dps has to do damage
Tank has to keep agroo
Healer has to keep the team alive.

Dragoon spams True Thrust -> Vorpal Thrust -> Full Thrust
Samurai spams Hakaze -> Jinpu -> Gekko
Dark Knight spams Unleash
White Mage spams Cure/Cure II

All three of met your baseline criteria yet only one role has a built in excuse whereas the other two are universally shunned. Bear in mind, each dungeon has a 90 minute time limit, thus if we're going by the dev's generous determination, success is completing it in that allotted time frame. I can assure you this group will finish any current dungeon. It may be agonizingly slow but nowhere is it stipulated DPS have to deal a specific amount of damage nor tanks have to deal more than the absolute minimum (none Paladin). If you're okay with an hour long Kugane Castle, fair enough. If, however, you expect more from the DPS and tanks, I expect more from you.

Dear Tanks,

Don't pull wall to wall if you want Healers to DPS. Thanks.

Can we please knock off the strawmen?

No one in this thread has advocated healers need to DPS above all else. We want them to be doing something. If tanks pull wall to wall and you can scarcely manage to get off more than one Aero III and maybe a Swiftcast Holy, good. You're spam healing, thus you're adhering to the standards of every other job: Always Be Casting. This thread is about healers who refuse to anything except heal regardless of the circumstances. For example purposes, I got into a row with a healer who insisted you were garbage if you ever allowed the tank's HP to dip below 80%. That renders abilities like Tetra and Essential utterly worthless since you'll never be low enough to truly benefit from their potency potential.

[Blanchimont]

Dragoon spams True Thrust -> Vorpal Thrust -> Full Thrust
Samurai spams Hakaze -> Jinpu -> Gekko
Dark Knight spams Unleash
White Mage spams Cure/Cure II

All three of met your baseline criteria yet only one role has a built in excuse whereas the other two are universally shunned. Bear in mind, each dungeon has a 90 minute time limit, thus if we're going by the dev's generous determination, success is completing it in that allotted time frame. I can assure you this group will finish any current dungeon. It may be agonizingly slow but nowhere is it stipulated DPS have to deal a specific amount of damage nor tanks have to deal more than the absolute minimum (none Paladin). If you're okay with an hour long Kugane Castle, fair enough. If, however, you expect more from the DPS and tanks, I expect more from you.

Can we please knock off the strawmen? No one in this thread has advocated healers need to DPS above all else. We want them to be doing something. If tanks pull wall to wall and you can scarcely manage to get off more than one Aero III and maybe a Swiftcast Holy, good. You're spam healing, thus you're adhering to the standards of every other job: Always Be Casting. This thread is about healers who refuse to anything except heal regardless of the circumstances. For example purposes, I got into a row with a healer who insisted you were garbage if you ever allowed the tank's HP to dip below 80%. That renders abilities like Tetra and Essential utterly worthless since you'll never be low enough to truly benefit from their potency potential.

This entire post is toxic. It immediately targets Healers as nothing but heal bots. It was started with a strawman argument accusing Healers of not DPSing. You want to know the reason why it happens though? It's because tanks pull wall to wall so that Healers don't get a chance to DPS at all. They're stuck on a mindless loop of spamming a heal every 3 seconds unless they're a WHM that has benediction up so that they can quickly cast an Aero III or something just so they can DPS with a DoT.

If you want Healers to use their full kits. You need to give them an opportunity to do so. Wall to wall pulls are barely even saving any time. In some cases, it's a waste of time and its even worse with a wipe. So, if you want Healers to do DPS, don't pull wall to wall like the idiot tank who wants to stand in AoEs like you are that forces Healers to dedicate even more time to spamming heals. That way you only guarantee Healers don't get a chance to cast any damage spells at all. It's like the stupid tanks who wait until their HP is down to 30% before the activate a cooldown.

However, keeping a tank at 80%+ is a viable strategy. For some classes, you need higher and the reason for that is that's about how much damage the tank buster deals. It's better to keep a tank topped off with smaller heals and avoid the need for the big cd instant cast spells that are for emergencies until when you really need it. That way, the chance of the tank dying to the tank buster drops to 0, even if the tank doesn't pop cds.

For starters, the more you pull, the less likely a Healer is going to be able to DPS because they're too busy keeping an idiot like yourself topped off because you pulled wall to wall instead of a small group. There's a reason why they are divided into small groups of usually 3 mobs and why most Healers only DPS in Raids. It's the only chance they ever get to assuming the tank that refuses to dodge AoEs.

[Deceptus]

This entire post is toxic. . .For starters, the more you pull, the less likely a Healer is going to be able to DPS they're too busy keeping an idiot like yourself topped off.

Hello pot, meet kettle.

If you want Healers to use their full kits. You need to give them an opportunity to do so.

Tanks using their defensive CD's gives healers the opportunity to do so. Also, you do realize every healer has some sort of mitigation that does damage as well right? Earthly star, Holy, Assize, Shadow Flare and most are instant cast.

[Elamys]

Tanks using their defensive CD's gives healers the opportunity to do so. Also, you do realize every healer has some sort of mitigation that does damage as well right? Earthly star, Holy, Assize, Shadow Flare and most are instant cast.

Er, not really. Earthly Star is instant, but has a delay upon execution (even if you detonate it immediately), one that's even longer if you wait for it to charge up, and it does very little damage. Shadow Flare also does very little damage, and a 5% Slow is not exactly much in the realm of mitigation. Neither of these can even be remotely compared to how strong Holy/Assize are, other than maybe "they're AoEs with no cast time"

[Taika]

You want to know the reason why it happens though? It's because tanks pull wall to wall so that Healers don't get a chance to DPS at all. They're stuck on a mindless loop of spamming a heal every 3 seconds unless they're a WHM that has benediction up so that they can quickly cast an Aero III or something just so they can DPS with a DoT.

I have played a healer in this game from 1.0 until current experts and extremes (I raid as BRD now so not experienced in that). I have never met a tank who has played in such a way that I have not been able to do any DPS at all. Unless they have been so ridiculously undergeared (or had broken gear) that they haven't been able to survive in the first place, in which case they shouldn't be in the instance anyway. Now this is not to say that if a tank is making super big pulls in DPS stance without using any cooldowns and with low item level the healer should just bite their tongue and step up. As many other people have said, if the actual healing (not spamming overheals) is keeping the healer busy (and not because they're using their healing abilities badly), that is fine. What people dislike is when the healing in itself doesn't keep the healer busy, and then the healer chooses not to do anything (useful) at all with their extra time. But also, if you do often encounter tanks playing in a way that prevents you from doing any DPS at all, you may want to check how you use your healing abilities.