Do you want a cash shop in FFXIV?

[Jennestia]

they could also give people a way to farm cash shop currency, in game.

Cut the middleman and just allow the items to be obtained by normal gameplay? Also it does, anytime SE offered something that is similar to what cashshops does, there's an uproar about it. You buy merchandise (i.e use real money) and get an in-game item, that's basically the same as a cash shop (trading real money for items), if people get upset over that, how do you think a cashshop would go over?

[Agoven]

Most successful MMOs eventually integrate in multiple avenues of revenue generation. Though introducing an MMO into the market for the first 1-5 years should hold back on too many options.

It's best to offer other options when an MMO is seasoned. When the subscriber base is at it's prime and and the sub base begins to decline that's when a company generally spurs growth by adding options.

WoW did it with it's collectible offline card game with codes for in-game. Lord of the Rings Online was failing and went the free to play model. There's a rhyme or reason to do certain things...

The core player base for FFXIV and FFXI is pretty solid or will be. There's no reason to move into multiple money making schemes. SE's main staple for games is story...and people pay for the rich environment of which to play in.

The Free to Play model of cash shops is generally regarded as a cheap method of obtaining profit and appealing to the rich people to rise to the top by paying their way. Such games then generally lack in substance or content or appeal unless you pay into the cash shop model.

I'm gonna simply state it this way and anyone can totally disagree. But the base for Cash Shop games is always small, maybe 10% if that of the population pays for anything (It does generate a lot of money...it certainly caters to people who have obsessive compulsive disorder), the quality of game is usually subpar, the community because it's saturated with nonpaying players is usually horrendous. Overall, people get tired of it really quickly and lots of huge drama all the time...and eventually the player doesn't stick around more then a few months.

[Aenarion]

Your facts are blurred by your own bias and therefore are flawed. Try looking up the actual facts. Those so called 'failed' games did not just survive their transition to freemium they thrived.

Sure they "thrived", in a quantity >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> quality way. What type of players did they attract? what sort of community did it built? what are the quality of the contents after the change? what sort of game-play did it encourage?

yea, that's what I thought. TBH, if i wanted to play Farmville/Maplestory/clone#28234789, I'd go play those games.

The proof is in the pudding. Doesn't matter much to me because I've finally come to the realization that these are just different ways of supporting something I love doing.

Didn't realize you love paying for stuff you shouldn't have to anyway. BTW, I have a couple bridges I'd like to sell...

I've heard and even said myself that I would quit MMOs forever if cash shops became the norm, but I've had to really look at it a lot more closely since then. The key is to steer the model to something you're comfortable with. Don't like pay to win items? Don't support it. But companies have already learned that lesson anyway.

Guess what, the inevitable end to the cash shop model IS pay to win. They may be able to stave it off for awhile, but that's where they all end up.

What isn't really being discussed enough here is that the freemium model offers more freedom for the customer and yet brings in more revenue because people are more likely to find your game more attractive if the entry point is open. It's not really about the evils of cash shops but more about offering diversity and options. Which is why I firmly believe that freemium and subscription hybrids will become the norm and not the crappy exception very soon, and one could argue it's already like this.

a freemium model depends on luring in as many people as they possibly can with the highest percentage of stupid people as they can so they'd actually pay for the fluffy stuff.

[WolfMoonstrike]

@Aenarion

I agree with a lot of what you said, except the freemium part. I believe this one can be done right such as Dungeons and dragons online. Which allows you to pay a subscription, buy pieces of the game individually and permanently, or play just the free areas.

Though that particular example has nothing to do with this argument going on in this thread.

This game should have nothing to do with a cash shop, I do not care about other games if they have cash shops or not. I'm playing FFXIV because I like FFXIV for what it is and what it may possibly be in the future. If I hear of a Cash Shop it immediately becomes something I will not enjoy. Then I move onto a different game; like I have done in the past when I don't enjoy something or disliked the direction it was going in. There are a thousand games out there that have been ruined by cash shops or have low player base retention. And sadly games like DDO are the exception and not the norm.

I still do not understand this want of asking for things that you have to pay cash for that should be content. I really believe WoW and CoD has turned this generation of gamers' minds to mush. It's really bad when the businesses make a blatant cash grab its even worse when consumers act like zombies and not only buy into but ask for it. To me its like going to prison and asking big bubba to give it to you.

[Cendres]

a freemium model depends on luring in as many people as they possibly can with the highest percentage of stupid people as they can so they'd actually pay for the fluffy stuff.

And this is why no reasonable discussion can be had on this matter if you persist in thinking so. Have a nice next 3 years my friend it might prove to be a rough time for you.

[Nuru]

Someone look up a free to play game with a cash shop and compare the financial stability with that of one that charges a monthly fee. Then come back and tell me the cash shop is a good idea. >.> If you can do this, then gold star for you, you can take the helmet off and I'll allow you to cross my bridge.

[Cendres]

Someone look up a free to play game with a cash shop and compare the financial stability with that of one that charges a monthly fee. Then come back and tell me the cash shop is a good idea. >.> If you can do this, then gold star for you, you can take the helmet off and I'll allow you to cross my bridge.

I'll reverse that for you, find me evidence that they do worse.

Some reading if anyone cares: The Free Zone: Everyone is Going F2P This is not by some kid, nvm it's on MMORPG.com

The last paragraph is what I feel is really important:

Also looking forward, Blanco expresses his belief that F2P and subscription can co-exist because they address different consumer preferences. "I like empowerment, and having the ability to choose how I want to patronize a game means a lot to me. For me, a subscription is a heavy commitment that represents a willingness to say I want to play this fun title for the foreseeable future and support it, its developers, and publishers. I also wish more games I subscribe to offered micro-transactions on some level. I believe they can all work together in a proper balance, especially for virtual world games, but it requires careful analysis and understanding of what players want from a game when they decide to pay."

Free For All Why someone chooses not to P2P.

Thing is we may think we have a lot of power hanging in these online communities with people who think very similarly, but we are just a small part of the whole consumer base and if MMOs want to keep going as they have they'll have to figure out ways to be competitive. Guild Wars 2 (sorry!) never had a sub fee, they will have an in game cash shop and sell a lot of merchandise on the side. This works well for them and the game as far as we know is of high quality. And that's just one example. I do believe Kingdoms of Amalur is going freemium too but not too sure. If it is, it will be the first major title to release as such. Maybe then perceptions will start changing on what it means to have diverse ways of payment.

[Aenarion]

Great, then go on and play your commitment-free F2P games, but stay the fk out of my games. I don't want nor care for the type of gameplay that are inevitably brought on by the advent of cash shops in MMOs.

from the same article you linked:

"At first, sales went down a bit. After some time though, they levelled out and actually began to increase from their previous state, given the same average numbers of concurrent players. Extra health and mana potions, elixir buffs, items and all the other categories of micro-transaction purchases started to go up.

You seem to have taken this to be a debate on the validity of the F2P model as a whole, while the rest of us are talking about the validity of a cash shop in FF14. You like F2P, we get it, go enjoy it, just leave that shit outside FF14, it doesn't need to be everywhere.

[Skyrant_Kangaroomouse]

How is this even worth discussing?

[Aenarion]

How is this even worth discussing?

because some people evidently think they obviously aren't paying enough money for things they don't need to be paying for in the first place.