Healer & Tank DPS (WoW vs FFXIV)

[Tufelhunden]

In a static group, sure I'll stance dance and dps. In finder or a PUG, rarely. Many times I've had to burn a cool down and use inner beast through the whole time and still almost die, because, yep you guessed it the healer is DPSing.

[Zarabeth]

In a static group, sure I'll stance dance and dps. In finder or a PUG, rarely. Many times I've had to burn a cool down and use inner beast through the whole time and still almost die, because, yep you guessed it the healer is DPSing.

I get complimented by tanks all the time because I heal and rarely dps. I do my best to keep everyone alive because I realize that DPS can out dps me for the most part. (I'm a WHM). If I have time, I'll toss out some DPS, but never at the expense of another player in the group. Letting others die because I'm going Holy Happy is just silly to me.

[Thunda_Cat_SMASH]

If I have time, I'll toss out some DPS, but never at the expense of another player in the group. Letting others die because I'm going Holy Happy is just silly to me.

Congrats, you're better than most healers here and in game. 10/10.

[Cenerae]

I get complimented by tanks all the time because I heal and rarely dps. I do my best to keep everyone alive because I realize that DPS can out dps me for the most part. (I'm a WHM). If I have time, I'll toss out some DPS, but never at the expense of another player in the group. Letting others die because I'm going Holy Happy is just silly to me.

I don't think anyone in the thread has been claiming that you're supposed to DPS at the expense of doing your actual job. People that do that are stupid.

[Tufelhunden]

I get complimented by tanks all the time because I heal and rarely dps. I do my best to keep everyone alive because I realize that DPS can out dps me for the most part. (I'm a WHM). If I have time, I'll toss out some DPS, but never at the expense of another player in the group. Letting others die because I'm going Holy Happy is just silly to me.

Love healers like you. I can go full DPS for the boss fights and just use the cooldowns for tank busters. Trash, yea I'm in deliverance for the IB mitigation so I don't have to blow cooldowns.

[Thoro39]

I don't think anyone in the thread has been claiming that you're supposed to DPS at the expense of doing your actual job. People that do that are stupid.

Exactly, her argument is a pretty moot and useless one. No one sane is arguing that a healer should abandon their healing duties for more DPS. Absolutely no one.

Love healers like you. I can go full DPS for the boss fights and just use the cooldowns for tank busters. Trash, yea I'm in deliverance for the IB mitigation so I don't have to blow cooldowns.

You should use your cooldowns on dungeon trash, because for the most part, Dungeon Trash hit for more damage than the Dungeon Bosses. Especially if you are a warrior with short defensive cooldown timers, your CD's will be ready by the next trash/dungeonboss if you use them early. Everytime vengeance sits unused for 2 minutes, you wasted a whole vengeance usage. The same applies for any cooldown.
Don't be an unnecessarily squishy Tank for 80% of the whole dungeon, just because you think you have to save your CD's exclusively for the other 20%, the bosses.

[loreleidiangelo]

Love healers like you. I can go full DPS for the boss fights and just use the cooldowns for tank busters. Trash, yea I'm in deliverance for the IB mitigation so I don't have to blow cooldowns.

So this is just kinda like, passing the DPS buck then; as it were? I mean, either way the extra damage is coming from somewhere, whether it's you playing offensively or a healer playing offensively.

I guess my question to tanks would be, would you RATHER your healer dedicate 100% of their casts to keeping you above 90%, or would you rather see them sling damage even if it means you get down to sub-30% sometimes? It's not a derisive question, I'm just curious. I read on Gen Discussion a lot that healers DPSing seems to make tanks nervous even IF everything winds up okay, so I guess I'm just trying to get a feel for tanks' preference.

[Seoulstar]

While arr and hw were more for the "tank and healer dps" for stormblood they seek to be trying to push that mentality away. Unless there was a new announcement, last I heard was they were making str stuff on tanks much lower because the want tanks to tank. Lots of hp.

And healers are definitely having to heal more and dps less now.



Anyways. The whole healer dps is a bag of bombs in its own right. Personally, I believe healers can pick. If they just want to heal, let them. That's their roll. Any dps they do is extra.

If only more people thought that way. But sadly it appears that will never be the case. It's general "DPS or be ridiculed, insulted, and harassed."

[Shurrikhan]

Why the emphasis? People looooooove to show off their numerical epeen on fflogs. If anyone says there's another reason they're probably lying to you and themselves.

Most of the decently dps-contributing healers and tanks I know either don't know what FFlogs is or aren't on the site.

They just notice this weird thing where, when they actually contribute, runs go faster. Shocker.

This is only because MP conservation is not a thing for healers. If healer MP regen was so low that they eventually hit a point where they go OOM regardless of what you do, the focus changes to smart use of MP and the tanks/DPS not taking more damage than needed.

But then you have to ask yourself—is standing idle fun? Even if thoughtfully done? We have the multiple ranks of MP- vs. time-efficiency, identically to WoW (save that we add potency rather than speed). Do we really want to shift emphasis from well-timed burst to using as few burst skills as possible, and standing around to regen mana? (Not that that's really a thing in WoW either at that point.)

If only more people thought that way. But sadly it appears that will never be the case. It's general "DPS or be ridiculed, insulted, and harassed."

Only by the same degree by which DPS who don't dodge or self-buff and tanks who don't use CDs or insist on having 5x the 2nd enmity's threat are ridiculed. Why would it be any different? They're wasting their own and/or others' potential contribution.

So this is just kinda like, passing the DPS buck then; as it were? I mean, either way the extra damage is coming from somewhere, whether it's you playing offensively or a healer playing offensively.

Fair enough, although actual efficiency will usually pass the torch back and forth between the healer's offensive mode (still maintaining efficient heals like oGCD usage on CD unless needing to be saved and HoTs) and the tank's whole-hog mode. That's part of what makes having a tank and healer who each know what they're doing, on each side, so fun.

Letting others die because I'm going Holy Happy is just silly to me.

You make it sound like these are divergent strategies. They're not. You apply your Regen and DoT if efficient, and then you continue to DPS until you need to heal again (or rather, until healing allows you more DPS). The proportion is irrelevant in itself. You just do what's efficient.

[RichardButte]

DPSing as a healer is weird for me because I've had situations where everything was going smoothly and I decided to DPS, and then seconds later the shit hit the fan and I found myself dangerously low on mana.

I wish healer DPS spells used next to nothing for mana. I'd feel more confident about throwing out damage then since I can't predict when party members are going to suddenly start standing in the bad.