Request: Move all stances off the GCD, remove all mana/gauge costs, and buff Defiance

[Tegernako]

Well then that would be really sad.

If they don't consider it, I fail to see the logic. Its an easy out from a long series of crappy design choices dating all the way back to ARR that have been messily and unevenly bandaged in ways that expertly evade balance and parity amongst 3 jobs that they promised us that they were making every effort to balance in lieu of adding a 4th job to the role.

Parity for them I guess is making DRK have like 200 400+ potency moves yet still doing less damage then PLD/WAR but hey...blackest night /s

Here is the issue. Most of the tanks in this game have no intention of stance swapping. That should made apparent of the ongoing tank dps rage in these forums.

I'd bet money most tanks stay in tank stance most of the time in dungeons and boss fights.

We're not talking ppl posting here. We're talking the entire playerbase. Most of which do 650 dps on average over the course of a raid.

[Kabooa]

I'd bet money most tanks stay in tank stance most of the time in dungeons and boss fights.

We're not talking ppl posting here. We're talking the entire playerbase. Most of which do 650 dps on average over the course of a raid.

I find this a little ridiculous because the forums don't come close to representing even 1% of the playerbase, and that playerbase it does represent is mixed all over the skill spectrum, not just the magical 'is gud' part of it.

[Conando]

Technically speaking defiance already has the overheal thing from adloqium, aspected benefic (nocturnal), and especially Divine Benison.

[YitharV2]

Technically speaking defiance already has the overheal thing from adloqium, aspected benefic (nocturnal), and especially Divine Benison.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you're saying, but what OP is saying is that currently when switching from Deliverance to Defiance, Defiance doesn't do anything for the Warrior in terms of mitigation. It requires the healer to heal the Warrior first. In order to make it on par with Shield Oath and Grit's instant mitigation, OP is suggesting that your current percentage of HP you have relative to your max HP in Deliverance applies when you use Defiance so if you have 20k out of 32k HP in Deliverance you will have 25k out of 40k HP when you pop Defiance.

[Tegernako]

I find this a little ridiculous because the forums don't come close to representing even 1% of the playerbase, and that playerbase it does represent is mixed all over the skill spectrum, not just the magical 'is gud' part of it.

I'm obviously exaggerating to make a point. Why take it seriously?

[Kabooa]

I'm obviously exaggerating to make a point. Why take it seriously?

Exaggeration and reasonable argument are rarely two things that mix well together. Sarcasm and exaggeration make for more entertained reading, certainly, but I can safely say my perception of most of the people that post in the class suggestion forum removes them as any sort of credible source on balance and design.

Your point is ultimately weakened by it.

[mcspamm]

Technically speaking defiance already has the overheal thing from adloqium, aspected benefic (nocturnal), and especially Divine Benison.

Speaking of which, was Defiance ever updated such that the healing boost also affects abilities (e.g. Lustrate, Tetra, Essential Dignity, Indom, Assize, Collective Unconscious, etc.)?

"Defiance
Increases maximum HP by 25%, while reducing damage dealt by 20% and increasing enmity.
Increases own HP recovery via healing magic by 20%."

As far as I'm aware, Defiance doesn't affect healing abilities, because they're still not considered "healing magic", although I could be wrong.

I remember reading posts here on the OF suggesting this be updated, such as http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...aling-received, which is a bit dated now.

If Defiance (still?) doesn't boost the potency of healing abilities, this raises another outstanding point of disparity between tank stances, in addition to Defiance requiring heals to active its defensive benefit.

[YitharV2]

Speaking of which, was Defiance ever updated such that the healing boost also affects abilities (e.g. Lustrate, Tetra, Essential Dignity, Indom, Assize, Collective Unconscious, etc.)?

"Defiance
Increases maximum HP by 25%, while reducing damage dealt by 20% and increasing enmity.
Increases own HP recovery via healing magic by 20%."

As far as I'm aware, Defiance doesn't affect healing abilities, because they're still not considered "healing magic", although I could be wrong.

I remember reading posts here on the OF suggesting this be updated, such as http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...aling-received, which is a bit dated now.

If Defiance (still) doesn't boost the potency of healing abilities, this raises another outstanding point of disparity between tank stances, in addition to Defiance requiring heals to active its defensive benefit.

It doesn't.

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...voting_me_and/

"Something completely not mentioned, but I feel is somewhat important - A gigantic amount of scholar's healing comes from abilities like fey union, lustrate, indom. ABILITIES. This means they are completely unaffected by largesse, fey illumination, etc. they are also completely unaffected by DEFIANCE, convalescence, mantra, brdmantra, etc. I hate seeing myself paired with a warrior in dungeon queues, because no matter what I do, they will be near 20% worse off than any other tank due to their tank stance being completely fucking useless for half my heals. Edit; FURTHERMORE, some wonderful dumb things: Eos is not affected by raise weakness at all. Fey union goes off of PET potency (roughly potency10.8, compared to healer potency of potency16.5), and is neither affected by rouse or illumination."

[Duelle]

Unfortunately, most WAR mains are calling for it to simply go back to being costless, which is not a solution; then we are back at square one with PLD and DRK having garbage GCD stance changes.

Stances are supposed to have a cost or trade-off. Depending on how the stance is designed, you're also supposed to stay in that stance to fulfill a specific purpose. That's how they're supposed to work; they're the stand-ins for functions or modes.

Stance dancing is important to your tanking customer base

Speak for yourself. Stance switches make sense when you have mechanical advantages to doing so. All you're asking for is needless button presses for the sake of increasing numbers. If the choices come down to killing stance switching under the current design or forcing stance switches on anyone that wants to even be considered for anything beyond story mode content, I'll pick to let stance switching die every time.

If you ask for one of the three tanks to be designed around stance switching, I'd be all for it. It means less unintended bullshit while giving people who are into pressing more buttons a class they can rally behind. What you're asking for ain't it, and to force it on everyone would be the sequel to Blizzard forcing active mitigation down everyone's throats 5 years ago.

And if stances are seen as such a bother to you, I'd say just get rid of them entirely; if the value and function of Shield Oath and Grit is overshadowed by "it lowerz mah deepz", then perhaps it's time we just cut off from it instead of pussyfooting around with stances under the false premise of "skill".

[Tegernako]

Exaggeration and reasonable argument are rarely two things that mix well together. Sarcasm and exaggeration make for more entertained reading, certainly, but I can safely say my perception of most of the people that post in the class suggestion forum removes them as any sort of credible source on balance and design.

Your point is ultimately weakened by it.

This isn't a academic paper I'm submitting though.

I had a good laugh at the second part of your post though. I'm not here to be the world's foremost authority on Warrior, I'm here to post how I feel and hope for changes.

I get what you are saying but to me this is like talking about it with my friends, we joke, we make snippy remarks, we laugh, we talk about how we feel, we tease each other, and we try and make our arguments all the while. If you don't find value in it or feel it lessons what I have to say, that's fine. But it's kind of pointless to take it seriously, just address the actual issue then and ignore obvious exaggerations and sarcasm then if it bothers you so much.

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...voting_me_and/

I always forget about this when talking about warrior tanking. It's another reason why tanking in deliverance was easier and that's because the differences between tank and dps stance are very small in comparison to the other thanks.