[Spoiler] Papalymo life worthness

[Kinkoz]

there was never a story where WoL goes on a journey to become stronger.

Our rise to prominence from humble beginnings throughout ARR's original story is a journey of becoming stronger in and of itself, as are the progressive substories of each Class/Job Quest. In addition, we pretty much had to EARN back the Blessing of Light for ourselves throughout Heavensward as well.

[Alleo]

Our rise to prominence from humble beginnings throughout ARR's original story is a journey of becoming stronger in and of itself, as are the progressive substories of each Class/Job Quest. In addition, we pretty much had to EARN back the Blessing of Light for ourselves throughout Heavensward as well.

I think Alise meant in SB. Yes we got stronger through HW and at the end of it we even were able to defeat Nidhogg. So the defeat of the big bad took a whole expansion and the eye of a dragon. Yet in SB we defeat Zenos and Shinyrue at the very start of the expansion. Yes ingame we leveled up but I am quite sure that we do not have levels in lore, simply because that would mean that a bug in the new zones could easily defeat all the voids in the old 24 man raids because those are <60 and the bug is 70. (As an example)

I would be able to believe the victory against such an enemy way more if we faced them at the end of SB. And I agree with Alise, there was never a true journey to become stronger. I would have liked if we came to the realization that we need to get stronger after Zenos and have us, as the WoL, focus on training. Maybe half of the expansion around training and learning more about the lore at the same time and the other half about freeing Doma. So that we would have the whole other expansion left to take back Ala Mhigo. Yet somehow we were getting way stronger by just helping out. There was simply no true scene where they show us go all out or something.

[EdwinLi]

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Zenos did state himself that when we first fight him we were far weaker than he was which is why he beat the WoL. Then in 2nd fight he manage to finally damage his armor and he then state that he wants us to live so we can become even stronger and how he regret looking down on WoL due to how much weaker he was during the 1st battle.

It is stated in the story that the 4.0 journey has made the WoL stronger just enough to finally to be able to defeat Zenos and Shinryu in the Final Dungeon though Zenos words.

[Berethos]

Yet in SB we defeat Zenos and Shinyrue at the very start of the expansion. Yes ingame we leveled up but I am quite sure that we do not have levels in lore

Our growth in strength is represented through three key in-game moments - the first time we fight Zenos in Rhalgr's Reach, the second time in Doma, and the final time in Ala Mhigo. The first time we barely make a dent against him and he's just toying with us. The second time we actually make an impression on him (represented in-game by actually getting him to roughly half health). And of course the final time when we do beat him.

We don't have "levels" in lore, but we do grow stronger in our abilities and what we are capable of doing, and it's actually represented in the story this time via an in-game representation.

[Kinkoz]

Yes we got stronger through HW and at the end of it we even were able to defeat Nidhogg. So the defeat of the big bad took a whole expansion and the eye of a dragon. Yet in SB we defeat Zenos and Shinyrue at the very start of the expansion.

But our initial fight wasn't against Nidhogg exactly – we technically dealt with him partway through the expansion. It was against Thordan and Heaven's Ward, whom, by your measure, we also defeated at the very start of the expansion. Nidhogg wasn't even the last, major threat we dealt with by the end of Heavensward; our "final battle" of the expansion was against the Warriors of Darkness, provided that you only view the events of 3.5 as merely a transitional story to accommodate Stormblood.