When will we get info on class changes?

[Velhart]

lol once again, in japanese its curse user, dont take the etymology of a translated word to literally.

Perhaps, but isn't using this a good excuse to make WHM derive from the THM class?

[Inaaca]

I love how people keep saying but CNJ has the elemental in their lore, mostly all spells have some type of element to them even Paralyna etc. Nukes are not the only spells in the game with elements tied to them. That life and death bull shit needs to go, the THM's guild that players join don't give a flying fuck about life, only death so that argument is invalid

The elemental aspect of CNJ lore goes well beyond the fact that they have elemental nukes. The guild literally defines what a CNJ is as the physical extension of the elements in your person. The CNJs speak to and deal with elementals as a critical part of what they do on a daily basis. Sure, every spell has an element, BUT those elementals don't come in astral and umbral, only the 6 elements of nature (fire, ice, wind, lightning, water, earth), matching CNJ nukes and the elements that BLM historically uses.

As for THM, they worship the god Nald'Thal, who deals in life and death. The THM guild is stationed in the Hall of Thal, and Thal is the half that deals in death. WHM, once introduced, can provide the balance THM needs, by filling the role stationed in the Hall of Nald, and taking up the half that deals in life. This completes the balance that THM is lacking in their lore.

[Physic]

The elemental aspect of CNJ lore goes well beyond the fact that they have elemental nukes. The guild literally defines what a CNJ is as the physical extension of the elements in your person. The CNJs speak to and deal with elementals as a critical part of what they do on a daily basis. Sure, every spell has an element, BUT those elementals don't come in astral and umbral, only the 6 elements of nature (fire, ice, wind, lightning, water, earth), matching CNJ nukes and the elements that BLM historically uses.

As for THM, they worship the god Nald'Thal, who deals in life and death. The THM guild is stationed in the Hall of Thal, and Thal is the half that deals in death. WHM, once introduced, can provide the balance THM needs, by filling the role stationed in the Hall of Nald, and taking up the half that deals in life. This completes the balance that THM is lacking in their lore.

I think what it boils down to, is whether one thinks of a black mage as an elementalist or a dark magic user. conjurer is definately the elementalist, and thaum is the dark /light magic user (but in this game we are mostly exposed to the dark magic user)
the real problem, is in their very creation, they wanted to not have the concept of i just heal and i just do dmg in these mage classes, one is supposed to work via elements the other via life and death. Now they want to make a large shift, and make them fit roles they were never meant for.

basically we cant look to lore, history and such to decide who will do what, because the truth is thaum and con both were made so they could either be a whm or a blm.

but looking at their recent changes, it seems con is leaning heavily toward whm, while its possible they could go 180 and let whm settle on thm, based on the job changes and the stat distributions and what not, it seems slightly more likely that thaum will get blm, the major thing making this a bit questionable, is the ancient magics, fairly powerful elemental nukes dont really gel well with our old concept of whm.

But who knows maybe the new whm wont be a pansypants with no elemental abilities.

[Inaaca]

I think what it boils down to, is whether one thinks of a black mage as an elementalist or a dark magic user. conjurer is definately the elementalist, and thaum is the dark /light magic user (but in this game we are mostly exposed to the dark magic user)
the real problem, is in their very creation, they wanted to not have the concept of i just heal and i just do dmg in these mage classes, one is supposed to work via elements the other via life and death. Now they want to make a large shift, and make them fit roles they were never meant for.

basically we cant look to lore, history and such to decide who will do what, because the truth is thaum and con both were made so they could either be a whm or a blm.

but looking at their recent changes, it seems con is leaning heavily toward whm, while its possible they could go 180 and let whm settle on thm, based on the job changes and the stat distributions and what not, it seems slightly more likely that thaum will get blm, the major thing making this a bit questionable, is the ancient magics, fairly powerful elemental nukes dont really gel well with our old concept of whm.

But who knows maybe the new whm wont be a pansypants with no elemental abilities.

The thing is though, if they're going to go with jobs as being throwbacks to classic Final Fantasy jobs, which they are, then BLM IS an elementalist at its core. Elemental nukes have always been the primary staple of BLMs.

Also, we CAN still look to lore, because they aren't going to rewrite it to fit new additions. They're going to make new additions that add to the lore we already have. Creating more lore to flesh out the already established world has been one of Yoshi's major goals from the start. So the lore we have is perfectly valid to speculate off of.

As far as the recent changes go, they were really only a quick bandaid fix to hold us over until they did the actual redo. I believe they gave CNJ Cure/Curaga/Raise because at the time, CNJ already HAD Cure/Raise, and it was easier at the time to just add to it instead of trying to rearrange abilities before they were ready to.

[grandm]

The thing is though, if they're going to go with jobs as being throwbacks to classic Final Fantasy jobs, which they are, then BLM IS an elementalist at its core. Elemental nukes have always been the primary staple of BLMs.

Also, we CAN still look to lore, because they aren't going to rewrite it to fit new additions. They're going to make new additions that add to the lore we already have. Creating more lore to flesh out the already established world has been one of Yoshi's major goals from the start. So the lore we have is perfectly valid to speculate off of.

As far as the recent changes go, they were really only a quick bandaid fix to hold us over until they did the actual redo. I believe they gave CNJ Cure/Curaga/Raise because at the time, CNJ already HAD Cure/Raise, and it was easier at the time to just add to it instead of trying to rearrange abilities before they were ready to.

i think CON will get blackmage, as you point out blackmage always has elemental nukes. sure they get other magic but always have elemental nukes. but this argument about jobs fitting lore, i have to look at paladin, and think ul'dah gladiators don't seem like knights with godly connections, nor do marauder. but i still put CON as blackmage

[Inaaca]

i think CON will get blackmage, as you point out blackmage always has elemental nukes. sure they get other magic but always have elemental nukes. but this argument about jobs fitting lore, i have to look at paladin, and think ul'dah gladiators don't seem like knights with godly connections, nor do marauder. but i still put CON as blackmage

It all depends on how they continue lore, I suppose. I don't think you can really say that class=job(ARC=BRD?). The two aren't the same thing, nor are they meant to be. Same goes with GLA/PLD, they aren't really the same thing, but they will be related in some way. I'm sure there will be some kind of nobility quest line that guides you down the path to becoming a PLD, and explains how this comes about.

[Physic]

It all depends on how they continue lore, I suppose. I don't think you can really say that class=job(ARC=BRD?). The two aren't the same thing, nor are they meant to be. Same goes with GLA/PLD, they aren't really the same thing, but they will be related in some way. I'm sure there will be some kind of nobility quest line that guides you down the path to becoming a PLD, and explains how this comes about.

yeah essentially they will all entail something to the effect of, OH you have studied this, interesting, but what do you really know of XYZ, come with me and i will show you how to hone your abilities to be a true master of ______.

So for glad it would probably be something, like, you have fought your way up in the pits of ul dah, and trained your body with hardship in the seas of limsa, but what do you know about truely protecting you group? I can show you how to be a paladin, and no enemy shall be able to touch your comrades without first ripping you from the face of the planet.

for blm i could imagine it going either way
talking about mastering the elmentals destructive potential, or thaumaturge abandoning the precepts of life to focus soley on the destruction of their foes.

[Exni]

I remember reading someone post that on that 2.0 render/picuture of the group fighting that chimera hydra thing, apparently you can see a WHM (from the white mage casting animation?) wielding a radical in his hand (CNJ weapon). Can't find the person's original post, but does anyone know if there's any truth to that?? I couldn't see much.. but mayb that's cuz I want cnj to be blm, cause that what the LORE already dictates (get it together Dev's ).

[Inaaca]

I remember reading someone post that on that 2.0 render/picuture of the group fighting that chimera hydra thing, apparently you can see a WHM (from the white mage casting animation?) wielding a radical in his hand (CNJ weapon). Can't find the person's original post, but does anyone know if there's any truth to that?? I couldn't see much.. but mayb that's cuz I want cnj to be blm, cause that what the LORE already dictates (get it together Dev's ).

Yeah, I looked into that, myself. Honestly, the referred to character (Agrias Oaks), is so small and surrounded in so many shiny effects that I can't make much out from it. I can't even tell what race Agrias is, much less what weapon he/she is wielding. Come to think of it, I don't even see anything depicting that it's supposed to be a WHM, so I'm really not sure what the so-called evidence is.

[ellohwell]

You mean YOU think he ruined the game, I reckon you are in a small minority, he already said that he will be fixing the issue with colour and stats on gear.

EVERY other MMO in the world requires you to hit a certain level before equiping items, so don't act so /surprised.

If every MMO jumped off a bridge would you do the same? Probably lemming.