Is it just me, or is this all pretty slapdash?

[Maeka]

See, IMO, they dug themselves a hole they don't know how to get out of. They made the DPS far too ridiculous, and now tanks are complaining they can't do enough DPS to be comparable, and they can't keep enmity so they think the solution is to stick more DPS stats on their jewelry instead of actually trying to tank. And so the healers start complaining about squishy tanks wearing DPS stats, and now they're scratching their heads going "oh my what a mess...."

*sigh*

So, then, the fastest band-aid is to dump enmity on tanks so that they can at least hold mobs without spamming Flash non-stop. But then, this makes some content ridiculously easy, but they at least want to at least put a stopgap on it, if nothing else, while they try to figure out what to do in 4.05.

I think at some point they're going to have to face the music that DPS is just too out of hand, and too ridiculous, and no manner of spongey mobs is going to fix that.

[Kumori_Kumo]

snip

It almost feels like it wouldn't have been an issue if HW hadn't happened. They obviously don't want tanks doing that much damage anymore, but once the genie's out of the bottle, any nerf feels terrible. I don't even like being an aggressive DPS-style tank but even I feel the hit to my power on the part of the boss fight where I contribute to spike damage and that Fell Cleave doesn't hit like it used to.

[Kinkoz]

See, IMO, they dug themselves a hole they don't know how to get out of. They made the DPS far too ridiculous, and now tanks are complaining they can't do enough DPS to be comparable, and they can't keep enmity so they think the solution is to stick more DPS stats on their jewelry instead of actually trying to tank.

You know, I've seen you mention this in two separate threads thus far and I feel like it should be called to your attention that damage output is also necessary for building and maintaining enmity, which is why people are prioritizing "DPS materia" melds and wearing 270 STR accessories over melding and wearing the newer Tanking stuff. On top of that, I feel you're not familiar with the fact that, in most cases, Tank gear is already designed to be at the maximum stat caps available for Tank-focused stats, which gives people a reason to meld that aforementioned "DPS materia" in order to shore up the damage stats that the pieces of gear lack.

[Daniel_Fury]

You know, I've seen you mention this in two separate threads thus far and I feel like it should be called to your attention that damage output is also necessary for building and maintaining enmity, which is why people are prioritizing "DPS materia" melds and wearing 270 STR accessories over melding and wearing the newer Tanking stuff. On top of that, I feel you're not familiar with the fact that, in most cases, Tank gear is already designed to be at the maximum stat caps available for Tank-focused stats, which gives people a reason to meld that aforementioned "DPS materia" in order to shore up the damage stats that the pieces of gear lack.

On single target 8 man fights, you can literally "Shirk Jerk" your way through the fight thanks to provoke/shirk synergy. STR accessories for emnity doesn't even matter at that point.

[Kinkoz]

On single target 8 man fights, you can literally "Shirk Jerk" your way through the fight thanks to provoke/shirk synergy. STR accessories for emnity doesn't even matter at that point.

Thus, when it isn't a matter of enmity, it becomes a matter of increasing one's performance and damage output.

[Daniel_Fury]

Thus, when it isn't a matter of enmity, it becomes a matter of increasing one's performance and damage output.

Exactly. This is the reason most players use them.
I prefer the HP from VIT personally. I usually pug everything, so the extra breathing space is nice for healers.

[Kinkoz]

Exactly. This is the reason most players use them.
I prefer the HP from VIT personally. I usually pug everything, so the extra breathing space is nice for healers.

And I never disagreed with that reasoning. The only reason I didn't call attention to it in that initial reply is on account of the fact that said explanations have already been stated hundreds of times already by others and I wanted to try my hand at explaining things from a different, potentially more understandable angle, since those who disagree seem to vehemently reject the notion that Tanks should rise above their station and provide respectable DPS as well.

As for the additional HP provided by Tank gear in lieu of actual Attack Power-increasing stats, I do believe a healer in another thread put it best: Having a large HP pool doesn't necessarily make it easier on healers to heal, since none of their spells actually scale with the increase to an allied target's health. Instead, it only makes it to where a healer needs to heal MORE in order to keep a Tank nice and healthy, and technically, you should never need to overinflate your HP in order to deal with things. So long as you have enough to survive mechanics, the rest of your stats should be built in such a way that increases your utility and performance which generally translates to damage output.

[VenKitsune]

They made the DPS far too ridiculous, and now tanks are complaining they can't do enough DPS to be comparable

Thing is that the kit that all tanks have gotten since 3.0 release has mostly been tools for doing extra damage, and a bit of extra utility. Unfortunately this is the way they've decided to design their tanks and healers; do damage as an extra while doing your role.