Please Please fix Warrior before the release of Raids

[P4X0R10N]

I got a 60 pld, but I main war. My war is 70. And I don't care about paladins. I don't want them nerfed. I don't even care about dps because it seems close enough.

What I care about is the actually mechanics of playing a warrior. It just feels wonky right now. I spent a few hours on a dummy just to practice my rotations. And it feels unfun..

[P4X0R10N]

Most of this stems from losing rage when swapping stances. Sure, infuriate helps with this, but it still feels aweful to see rage drop on stance swap and feeling that you have to waste time doing combos again to build it back up.

Can't they find a less punishing way of dealing with this?

[vigioX-Sun]

-Butcher block needs to be increase to 20 rage leave eye at 10 is just fine that way(MT gauge fills too slow making the game play boring an slow)(MT Butcher OT Path) MT will never lose aggro if war OT
-no penalty on tank stance change
-Onslaght no rage cost, make it use TP/MP longer CD whatever even nerf it who cares, i just dont wanna use it because it cost rage that all my other skills need, for that i just sprint ,all we really wanted is to close gap really...
-remove inner release/ Unchaine from sharing CD
-increase berserk to 40% or fell cleve to 650 potency, its not enough anymore
-no sure about shake it off, dont work 80% of the time
PST: dear developers, dont forget you took all our tools an utility away, most of us have accept that but you went too deep on changing the class an totally forgot the fun core of the job, remember what ppl love about it an make it better.
dont touch PLD they are beautiful on his on way ,im happy for them they really need it all those shiny tools, now i can see them as real PLD, the party protector an utility tank/mass survival,im gonna love to OT for them but dont forget what makes war a warrior...

[TouchandFeel]

I agree that the BG cost for swapping stances should be lowered. I'm fine with it having some cost but it I feel it is too much at the moment. Maybe put a cap on how much BG the swap can cost and then balance the cap to feel right?

I also agree Onslaught is in need of improvement. It's cost overshadows its benefit by far. The easy solution would of course be to get rid of it's BG cost, but I think it might be interesting to instead add a DoT to it so in a ways giving Fracture back and providing a use for it in the middle of a fight.

WAR also could use some party utility. I'm still not entirely sure what and how exactly but I was thinking it might be interesting and fitting if it was something along the line of increasing a target or the party's max HP by X% for 10 seconds or something like that, allowing for the potential of an extra bit of HP cushion for party/raidwide damage or tank busters while mimicking WAR's tank stance somewhat.

I'd also support Inner Release and Unchained not sharing the same timer as long as stance swapping kept a (reduced) cost.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Is this the only thing you'd like to have increase Beast Gauage? Or adjust in terms of that? Just curious.

Watching all these veteran warriors suggest these things, some are nice changes. Some I feel are a bit over powered. It's a great learning experience for me though, and it's nice to see my SMN's and WHM's aren't as crazy as I thought but do look at them as an example of be careful what you wish for.

Additional ways to generate gauge would be nice. I did purpose Bloodbath return, but instead of healing us, it generates Beast Gauge similar to Blood Weapon with MP. Honestly, if they scrapped the stance swap penalty and just made Onslaught a copy of Plunge, I'd be okay with it. I would like more, however my immediate concern with Warrior at the moment is how clunky it feels to play.

[BluexBird]

Right now it feels like Paladins are able to tank, deal damage with an easier and more fluid rotation, AND they can do so much to make sure things don't go in the wrong direction.

It's like someone else could be tanking, and if you notice someone is in trouble... BAM! Use Cover on them.

Someone slipped and is about to cause your party to lose a bunch of HP. BAM! Divine Veil.

Intervention to help the main tank stay alive in situations where you feel like they might not make it.

And then there's Clemency. "OMG why would Paladins... ever use THAT, it's such a DPS loss!" YOU KNOW WHAT ELSE IS A DPS LOSS?! WHEN ONE OF YOUR DAMAGE-DEALERS DIE! IDIOTS!

Not to mention they don't have to drop one of their role actions for a stun.

Compare all that with what the other two tanks can do. Yes, they can also tank just as well (nothing considerable). Yes, they can deal damage (nothing considerable). And that's it. They bring nothing else to the table.

By these standards, Paladins have become A LOT better, making it it unfair to the other two tanks. The only real reason to be a Warrior or Dark Knight is because of their animations and character fantasies. But that's just not a valid reason to make Paladin stand out so much the way they currently do.

[aleph_null]

If butcher's block's gauge generation is increased to 20 then its potency should be reduced to match storm's path combo (either -40 potency on butcher's block or -30 on butcher's block and -10 on skull sunder) or even lower, otherwise we'll go back to the old problem of the enmity combo being the strongest dps combo as well. Personally I think it's fine for butcher's block combo to generate less gauge than storm's path, just like other tanks' enmity combo being weaker than their other combos. Nothing wrong for our enmity combo to come with some dps cost.

[SargentToughie]

If butcher's block's gauge generation is increased to 20 then its potency should be reduced to match storm's path combo (either -40 potency on butcher's block or -30 on butcher's block and -10 on skull sunder) or even lower, otherwise we'll go back to the old problem of the enmity combo being the strongest dps combo as well. Personally I think it's fine for butcher's block combo to generate less gauge than storm's path, just like other tanks' enmity combo being weaker than their other combos. Nothing wrong for our enmity combo to come with some dps cost.

Or you could make tank design actually good, and make it so that tanks actually feel rewarded for using their enmity combo, and gathering threat.

Right now the goal of optimizing tank play is to generate the LEAST amount of threat possible while still keeping hate, that's not okay.

[aleph_null]

Or you could make tank design actually good, and make it so that tanks actually feel rewarded for using their enmity combo, and gathering threat.

Right now the goal of optimizing tank play is to generate the LEAST amount of threat possible while still keeping hate, that's not okay.

Why is it not okay? It's just like how healers strive to generate the least amount of heal while keeping people alive. The enmity generation itself is the "reward" from using your enmity combo. Asking for the enmity combo to also be the best dps combo is imo just like asking for heals to also do damage to the boss to make healers feel rewarded for using their heals.

[Alphras]

Right now the goal of optimizing tank play is to generate the LEAST amount of threat possible while still keeping hate, that's not okay.

I think that is a nice way to give the role some depth. Enmity management was always way too easy in this game.