Tanks and healers.

[Aramina]

Party members making elitist dictatorial comments CAN be removed as well.

Indeed they can.

[SomeRandomHuman]

Oh good, I'm here before the show starts!



time to start munching

[Chronons]

Party members making elitist dictatorial comments CAN be removed as well.

I have absolutely zero problems if the party wants to kick me because I don't want to carry someone through content. In fact please do so I don't have to wait out a penalty. That doesn't make someone an elitist. Everyone has a limited amount of time to play the game, if you want to spend it helping people who refuse to help themselves, that is your prerogative. That doesn't make someone bad for not wanting to. Sick of seeing "elitist" thrown around in lieu of adding something concrete to the discussion.

Lets say for the sake of argument that you que in the DF with three party members who want to RP walk through an entire dungeon. Are you duty bound to stick it out less you become apart of this so called "elitism"? Or would you agree that that playstyle falls outside of the community accepted "norm"? If so then you have the right to leave or vote kick them (if it were say one or two people instead of three) without the undue judgement of the FFXIV forums.

[Thunda_Cat_SMASH]

Tank DPS isn't going anywhere. Whether the content hits hard enough for tank stance to be essentially mandatory or not, tanks will still look to maximize their dps in every way possible. This is good because tanks are required to dps regardless.

[Hazuki87]

My point is that I should not be in that position. It's not the role I picked. The people who did pick it should learn how to play their own role better rather than expecting the other people to play two roles good so they can slack off.

^^^100%^^^
This is what most ppl don't get!

On a side note!
Befor I get started here, I'm a DPS WHM! But I also solo heal ALOT of endgame, that aside keep this in mided as you read.

You say healers need to DPS, because there a lot of free time, and the party need more DPS to clear the fight, way is it the healers job to DPS for you and do you're job? If there a lot of free time for the healer kick the 2nd one and get a 5th DPS so you don't have to make them do something they did not ask for. You don't make the DPS in your party jump to a diff DPS job just because you like it more.. Or you need it in the mid of the fight, way you're in the dungen....No you look for ppl to fill the roles befor going in! You want a DPS/healer, you LOOK for one to join you that want to do both jobs, not make one do it.

There no rule in the game saying you NEED 2 healers... You can Premake the party any way you wish! learn the fight with 2healers, then when you have it somewhat down, have the OH jump to a main DPS role and help push the fight for the clear. It only take ONE healer to heal every 4-8 man fight in this game. And 3 for 24man( hell if you Premake a 24 man, you only need one heal so long as everyone works together.)

My point is if a DPS can't even do there job, there ONLY job right! way the hell make tanks and healer do 2 job to make up for your bad dpsing or lazy playing? If you want a DPS healer, FINE ONE don't make other do something they don't like or wish to do, everyone has there own way of playing, no one is you're slave.

[Kacho_Nacho]

OP, don't worry. I'm certain there will be ample opportunity for tanks and healers to help with the damage dealing in Stormblood.

As far as the should healers dps debate, what can be said that hasn't be said already? The topic is emotional and the debate is heated, radioactive even, with people posting threads so extreme they have to be trolling. Let's all bury this road pizza of a dead horse and move on.

[akaneakki]

Party members making elitist dictatorial comments CAN be removed as well.

''Hey sir, I see you cast fire and ice between every 2 cast, BLM does more dmg when you cast fire, fire 3 is casted after blizzard 3 and a thunder to fill your mp up, then you use fire 1 to cast. The reason why, is because you get umbral stacks x3 after a fire 3 and fire 1 does more dmg and its faster to cast as well, which makes you dps more. If you cast fire 2 on more than 3 mobs, thats also very good'' > Gets kicked because elitist.

[YitharV2]

Pushing DPS on tank was the only thing that made me enjoy tanking in this game.

Yeah, I'd say it was fun. I really think SE needs to do something to make tanking and healing more challenging and fun. In TERA, tanks had to actively mitigate damage so it was sort of a challenge to block everything and take zero damage, and aggro was pretty hard to hold against good DPS. I don't necessarily think there's anything wrong with having a learning curve, because if you make things too easy then people don't want to play anymore.

Tank DPS isn't going anywhere. Whether the content hits hard enough for tank stance to be essentially mandatory or not, tanks will still look to maximize their dps in every way possible. This is good because tanks are required to dps regardless.

I think it'll be lowered a bit for WAR at least, because WARs are now penalized for stance dancing. If you need Inner Beast and you're in Deliverance you can either get your gauge halved, or spend the gauge on Fell Cleaves and then rebuild the gauge in Defiance (which is a DPS loss either way).

My point is if a DPS can't even do there job, there ONLY job right! way the hell make tanks and healer do 2 job to make up for your bad dpsing or lazy playing? If you want a DPS healer, FINE ONE don't make other do something they don't like or wish to do, everyone has there own way of playing, no one is you're slave.

Maybe that's some people's argument, but that was never mine. Mine was that you should play efficiently with other people and your skills are not there to look pretty. I do think there's a lot to be said about tank and healer carrying DPS. As I've said I don't make anyone do anything. That doesn't mean I have to be happy when someone is standing there looking pretty for half the time.

[KisaiTenshi]

''Hey sir, I see you cast fire and ice between every 2 cast, BLM does more dmg when you cast fire, fire 3 is casted after blizzard 3 and a thunder to fill your mp up, then you use fire 1 to cast. The reason why, is because you get umbral stacks x3 after a fire 3 and fire 1 does more dmg and its faster to cast as well, which makes you dps more. If you cast fire 2 on more than 3 mobs, thats also very good'' > Gets kicked because elitist.

There is a difference between "suggesting" and "being too much of an elitist"

If i'm playing a role that I feel I know well, being told how to do my job by someone else is probably just going to get ignored unless I haven't played that duty at all. I'm willing to take advice on tanking, but good gawd, don't tell healers how to do their job unless someone dies/wipes. There is something rather humiliating about wiping to the trash mobs due to over-confidence and not to the boss.

[akaneakki]

There is a difference between "suggesting" and "being too much of an elitist".

I never mentioned healers but while we at it, regen is the spell you want on tank at all times. If you know you do well thats fine, if You "feel you do well is a whole different thing. Most people "feel it too but in reality dont do so well. Anyways, most people say given advice or correct others is elitist attitutude. Ever wonder why less people help these days? Because of people taking things wrong way.