A consern about space efficieny since stormblood is not getting enough space increase

[Lycieus]

There is an entire chain of damage that can be created from a single bug, and so far we've not seen any version of this except when SE went and deleted large sums of gil from players during the 2.0 era. Players who had dealt with duped items had their gil decimated.

So your point is we can't have a glamour log because Square-Enix exclusively can't deal with these sort of issues?

[savageink]

So your point is we can't have a glamour log because Square-Enix exclusively can't deal with these sort of issues?

Lol! She does seem to be arguing for their incompetence.

[Shurrikhan]

There is an entire chain of damage that can be created from a single bug, and so far we've not seen any version of this except when SE went and deleted large sums of gil from players during the 2.0 era. Players who had dealt with duped items had their gil decimated.

In that case, at what point in design is SE, if so incompetent, not opening themselves up to exploits?

Release 2.0's bug, wherein item count was carried client side, iirc, allowing Allagan coins to be multiplied by 99 and sold off 98 at a time, infinitely, may be evidence of prior incompetence, but it doesn't say anything about what would likely go wrong with a glamour log. What bugs, specifically would you expect to occur?

[OcieKo]

In that case, at what point in design is SE, if so incompetent, not opening themselves up to exploits?

Release 2.0's bug, wherein item count was carried client side, iirc, allowing Allagan coins to be multiplied by 99 and sold off 98 at a time, infinitely, may be evidence of prior incompetence, but it doesn't say anything about what would likely go wrong with a glamour log. What bugs, specifically would you expect to occur?

If handled like the gil duping example, a person could feasibly change all the 0s in the script for 1s and just hand themselves a full log for nothing. Should be possible to mostly save it client side while making a server side save upon log out, and using said file to double check upon log in. Might make it take a bit longer to log in/out and extend the time your character is tied up after a disconnect, but probably less than constant info transfers. Someone with more (or any really compared to me) experience in network coding may be able to explain it better.

[Shurrikhan]

If handled like the gil duping example, a person could feasibly change all the 0s in the script for 1s and just hand themselves a full log for nothing. Should be possible to mostly save it client side while making a server side save upon log out, and using said file to double check upon log in. Might make it take a bit longer to log in/out and extend the time your character is tied up after a disconnect, but probably less than constant info transfers. Someone with more (or any really compared to me) experience in network coding may be able to explain it better.

I guess I just rreeeaaaallllyyy want to hope that SE wouldn't break Rule 101 (don't trust the client, let alone hand them the ability to manipulate their stats, states, or inventory) twice.'

I really wish I knew more about these things; all the stuff I've found so far has said that when an item is added to one's inventory, in any form, it's added to the server listing for that player, while all the client side caches is the information tied to those items' tags and their arrangement within the inventory.

In my experiences being hacked multiple times and having my inventory rolled back in WoW this would also appear to be the case. The way GMs explained this to me is that they simply sort all server item transactions by player, formulaically flag them for suspicious activity within the reported date parameters, and then revert all changes between the chosen point and the reporting date.

In either case, it doesn't appear that there ought to be any way for the player to manipulate a server list.

But again, I know nothing about this. I'm just summarizing some hour's insomniatic research and anecdotal findings.

[Alleo]

And what exactly would be the bad outcome for other players IF someone hacks it and gets themselves a full glamour book? You could simply say that everything that comes from the cash shop will go into the special chest (sorry dont know its English name) and the rest that is obtainable ingame into the glamour book. So people could not get something that would normally cost real life money. I just dont truly understand the risk for others or the fear from SE`s side..if its gil, then it could destroy the market balance since people could buy anything they want (but like I already pointed out...SE is really good at destroying the ingame market themselves). But glamour is only good for the person itself. They might go around and show some stuff off but you can also do that if you own that in a legitimate way.

Its just..with a glamour book lots of inventory problems could be solved and its even something that will help the game throughout its life time..also it might motivate people to run old content again. (Gonna get them all) These positives are imo worth quite a lot more than the fear of someone that could hack it.

Will it be quite the work to make a good system? Probably! But we will need it at one point or another..because otherwise they might just simply loose players. Glamour is one important part of the game and if you cant get new glamour because you simply have no space left to store it and at the same time are no hoarder..well why play the game anymore?

So please stop with all the excuses because imo SE reasons are just that. If you want to be part of the top MMOs around the world you really need at least all the common functions, otherwise people might look to the competitors because a beautiful looking MMO is not something that will keep most gamers playing.

[Ama_Hamada]

https://gamerescape.com/2017/05/31/a...naoki-yoshida/

In terms of the inventory of the retainer, unfortunately we do not have any plans at the moment. Of course increasing the number of retainers you can hire might be something that can be considered. But expanding on the capacity of the retainer itself is not being planned for at all.

With retainer inventory, it’s a matter of duplication so that your retainer’s items won’t be lost, or split up, or have any sort of issues with it. Of course it’s not technically impossible to increase the capacity, it is something that we have to be very careful about managing.

If we were to expand it without great consideration, it would affect the responsiveness of the retainer. It does affect the responsiveness, the sort of data back and forth between the server and the client and we’ll sort’ve delay if we’re not mindful of how we expand the inventory. And so you might end up with a case where you’re moving inventory out of your retainers possession, it might take a full second to respond. So we are not really able to increase the capacity at this point.

Hopefully it will help, it might not be a full replacement but, the development team is currently considering working on an app for the smartphone where you can go in without having to log in to the game itself but be able to manage the inventory of your retainers through that.

So their code is subpar, we knew that. Again the retainer interface is already too slow, esp if you have 8 of them. This only reinforces the idea that retainers storing items and interfacing with the market boards needs scraping entirely. This is based off 1.0 and it became outdated when 2.0 was made (the retainer system)

They need to stop looking at "How does the current system limit us" and looking at "How can we make a system with less limitations?" Make a real storage space like how every other game has storage banks, have retainers only be for ventures. This will also lessen the gap limitation of "pay to win" sort of speak when it comes to selling things if the market board has listings by the player directly like any other game. When most people sell 40 items I can sell 480+ slots is that fair?

It is clear retainers is just a leftover from 1.0 and was bridged to 2.0 because it was tolerable then. Now 3.0+ the retainer system is a failure because how much items this game has now.

[Niwashi]

If handled like the gil duping example, a person could feasibly change all the 0s in the script for 1s and just hand themselves a full log for nothing.

But that bug was (or the hypothetical one would be) based on client side control of server side data. That's why you never let the client control such data. Keep it where it belongs, and no such abuse can take place. The fact that a horribly designed feature could be vulnerable is no reason to avoid implementing features. It's just a reason to not design them so horribly.

[Niwashi]

Back in 2014 they seemed to think a glamour log was feasible enough. They were just trying to decide how much other information it would also include.

0:52:08
Q: Is there any update on the weapon and armor log?

A: We've currently finished off a lot of the details, but we have to plans for implementation, we've been estimating the amount of work for each. The first idea would simply have players building a collection of weapons and armor, while the second idea would allow players to read the lore surrounding the gear they obtain. However, this data will affect the player data used in real time, so we are carefully investigating this at the moment. Next week we will reach a conclusion and proceed for actual implementation, but if we decide to go with the first idea it will be implemented in patch 2.4. In the case we decide on the second option, it will be implemented a bit further in the future. In any event, we've progressed quite a bit on this and we will have our verdict soon enough.

Since they thought at that point it would be implemented in the next major patch if they went with the simple version just recording what gear we do and don't have, I'm guessing they decided on the more in-depth version giving detailed info about each item, and then it got bogged down in coming up with all that background info. They took what would have been an enormously helpful feature that they could have done if they'd kept with the simple version and instead expanded it into something too big to actually get finished/implemented.

[Shurrikhan]

Back in 2014 they seemed to think a glamour log was feasible enough. They were just trying to decide how much other information it would also include.


Since they thought at that point it would be implemented in the next major patch if they went with the simple version just recording what gear we do and don't have, I'm guessing they decided on the more in-depth version giving detailed info about each item, and then it got bogged down in coming up with all that background info. They took what would have been an enormously helpful feature that they could have done if they'd kept with the simple version and instead expanded it into something too big to actually get finished/implemented.

If that's the case...
/remembering Yoshida critiquing or outright discounting Tanaka over basically the same thing >.>