Warrior and paying for skills the other two use for free, among other thoughts

[Marxam]

I've main war since 2.0 launch and even tested it a bit in beta and going into 4.0 puts us in a weird situation. Onslaught I agree is quite niche for the cost it requires. Upheaval is a decent off-gcd for the same cost as Onslaught. Shake it off is nice to have, especially in PvP, though content design will determine its utility. Inner Release looks like a great ability on paper and the amount of immunity it provides is really good and the trait for Infuriate cd reduction is only a good thing. However, you can't Infuriate outside of battles, we lost bloodbath, brutal swing and even though you can block and parry from behind in 4.0 why does Raw Intuition still crit from behind.

I only really have issues with two skills but here's a couple of options to improve their viability among other QoL things.

Defiance/Deliverance

-Costs 25 beast gauge. 10 second recast.

Berserk

- Additionally restores 20% of damage dealt as hp. Duration and recast unchanged.
- Increase Berserk to 40% increase in Attack Power. Duration and recast unchanged. (Highly controversial but just throwing it out there)
- Increase direct critical hit rate by 10%. Duration and recast unchanged.

Storm's Path, Storm's Eye, Butcher's Block

- All give 20 Beast gauge. Storm's Path heals for 100% of damage dealt. (much needed imo)

Infuriate trait

- Inner Beast, Steel Cyclone, Fell Cleave, Decimate, Onslaught, Upheaval reduces Infuriate recast timer by 5 seconds upon using the action/skill. (Much needed QoL)

Onslaught

1. Give Onslaught a stun, duration 3 seconds. 20 Gauge.
2. Increase potency to 200. 20 Gauge..
3. Reduce cost to 10 Beast gauge. Potency and cd unchanged.

Upheaval

1. Give Upheaval a stun. Gauge is unchanged.
2. Upheaval gains a 100% Direct Critical Hit at 100% hp. Gauge is unchanged. (I would love this)
3. Upheaval puts a DoT for 18 seconds. Potency 20. Potency unchanged.
4. Gain "Hungry Beast" buff. 20% of damage dealt is converted into HP. 10 seconds. Gauge and potency is unchanged.


Atm WAR's theme is of this "reckless abandon, angry berserk tank" but some of the skills hold that back with the high cost of beast gauge. I'm still excited for war in 4.0 but it still needs a few more touch ups, specifically stance switching costs, increasing all combo finishers to 20 gauge, Infuriate trait fix and the viability of Onslaught in PvE. Also I'm sure the OP hasn't seen any of the tool tips but WAR still is the only tank with a Slashing debuff.

MTQ Tool Tip video

4.0 Embargo Skill changes

[shao32]

Storm's Path, Storm's Eye, Butcher's Block gauge stuff

if you do that you kill the purpose to keep all combos equal value in combat, no one go to use storm path for a small self heal only when the others offer more dps, agro and dps buffs.

[Marxam]

if you do that you kill the purpose to keep all combos equal value in combat, no one go to use storm path for a small self heal only when the others offer more dps, agro and dps buffs.

The point is to have all 3 combos in rotation. As it is currently Storm's Path has priority over all other combos because it give 20 gauge not to mention the self heal, since we lost Bloodbath, will most likely be more important now than ever. If all three combo finishers give 20 gauge then there is more flexibility in the rotation instead of SE combo once then SP combo till slashing/SE debuff refresh. Having an enmity, heal and slashing buff combo all give 30 gauge all together can only be a good thing for WAR.

[Cabalabob]

The point is to have all 3 combos in rotation. As it is currently Storm's Path has priority over all other combos because it give 20 gauge not to mention the self heal, since we lost Bloodbath, will most likely be more important now than ever. If all three combo finishers give 20 gauge then there is more flexibility in the rotation instead of SE combo once then SP combo till slashing/SE debuff refresh. Having an enmity, heal and slashing buff combo all give 30 gauge all together can only be a good thing for WAR.

The whole point is storm's path is your dps combo, storm's eye is your utility combo and BB is your aggro combo. You're meant to only use storm's eye to keep your damage up buff on, path is the one you spam thanks to extra beast gauge and BB is only if you need enmity.

This is the same setup as PLD with royal authority as dps, goring blade as utility and rage of halone for aggro. DRK is similar with souleater for dps and powerslash for enmity, but DRK has no utility combo.

[Baci]

The whole point is storm's path is your dps combo, storm's eye is your utility combo and BB is your aggro combo. You're meant to only use storm's eye to keep your damage up buff on, path is the one you spam thanks to extra beast gauge and BB is only if you need enmity.

This is the same setup as PLD with royal authority as dps, goring blade as utility and rage of halone for aggro. DRK is similar with souleater for dps and powerslash for enmity, but DRK has no utility combo.

Thats all nice, if Storms Path would actually do more dmg than the other combos *table flip*

[Reynhart]

Thats all nice, if Storms Path would actually do more dmg than the other combos *table flip*

With the extra beast gauge, you get to use Fell Cleave up to two GCD earlier than with Butcher's Block or Storm's Eye, that's the DPS gain.

[Marxam]

The whole point is storm's path is your dps combo, storm's eye is your utility combo and BB is your aggro combo. You're meant to only use storm's eye to keep your damage up buff on, path is the one you spam thanks to extra beast gauge and BB is only if you need enmity.

I'm sure you are not aware but BB combo has always been WAR's dps combo AND enmity combo at 280 potency compared to Storm's Path 250 potency. Why do you think WAR's always rip hate in their dps stance? It's because they are using the BB combo. However, I honestly see no wrong in having all 3 combos give 30 gauge respectively. Is there a reason you only want to get 20 gauge for maintaining slashing debuff, dmg buff and enmity when you can do both and gain 30 gauge respectively instead? More gauge building is only a good thing.

I'm also sure you are aware that we lost bloodbath, well all tanks lost bloodbath but I can see how OP it will be given the amount of aoe dmg all tanks have and especially for WAR. So people will spam SP combo if they want to. I just don't want to to miss out on extra gauge just because I'm trying to keep my buff/slashing up or trying to gain enmity.

Btw WAR has always had two utility combos, one for self healing and one for slashing debuff and only one dps/enmity combo. Storm's Path was never a dps combo and was only used for a small self heal and it's dmg debuff which is gone in 4.0.

[shao32]

snip

or you make storm path is the best dps combo or ppl go to delete of they cross bars, ppl already try to avoid path every time they can, if you think ppl go to use it for a misery self heal you are complety wrong, now if you need agro you use butcher, thanks to this system we dont go to have to dealt with those warrios using buthcher as they dps rotation on OT, and if you are MT you go to use all of then per equal.

and well we dont have the final numbers yet, but the speed as war generate gauge with the current numbers is pretty fine 20-30 points per combo its the same as the current stack system.

[YanDere]

I've main war since 2.0 launch and even tested it a bit in beta and going into 4.0 puts us in a weird situation. Onslaught I agree is quite niche for the cost it requires. Upheaval is a decent off-gcd for the same cost as Onslaught. Shake it off is nice to have, especially in PvP, though content design will determine its utility. Inner Release looks like a great ability on paper and the amount of immunity it provides is really good and the trait for Infuriate cd reduction is only a good thing. However, you can't Infuriate outside of battles, we lost bloodbath, brutal swing and even though you can block and parry from behind in 4.0 why does Raw Intuition still crit from behind.

I only really have issues with two skills but here's a couple of options to improve their viability among other QoL things.

Defiance/Deliverance

-Costs 25 beast gauge. 10 second recast.

Berserk

- Additionally restores 20% of damage dealt as hp. Duration and recast unchanged.
- Increase Berserk to 40% increase in Attack Power. Duration and recast unchanged. (Highly controversial but just throwing it out there)
- Increase direct critical hit rate by 10%. Duration and recast unchanged.

Storm's Path, Storm's Eye, Butcher's Block

- All give 20 Beast gauge. Storm's Path heals for 100% of damage dealt. (much needed imo)

Infuriate trait

- Inner Beast, Steel Cyclone, Fell Cleave, Decimate, Onslaught, Upheaval reduces Infuriate recast timer by 5 seconds upon using the action/skill. (Much needed QoL)

Onslaught

1. Give Onslaught a stun, duration 3 seconds. 20 Gauge.
2. Increase potency to 200. 20 Gauge..
3. Reduce cost to 10 Beast gauge. Potency and cd unchanged.

Upheaval

1. Give Upheaval a stun. Gauge is unchanged.
2. Upheaval gains a 100% Direct Critical Hit at 100% hp. Gauge is unchanged. (I would love this)
3. Upheaval puts a DoT for 18 seconds. Potency 20. Potency unchanged.
4. Gain "Hungry Beast" buff. 20% of damage dealt is converted into HP. 10 seconds. Gauge and potency is unchanged.


Atm WAR's theme is of this "reckless abandon, angry berserk tank" but some of the skills hold that back with the high cost of beast gauge. I'm still excited for war in 4.0 but it still needs a few more touch ups, specifically stance switching costs, increasing all combo finishers to 20 gauge, Infuriate trait fix and the viability of Onslaught in PvE. Also I'm sure the OP hasn't seen any of the tool tips but WAR still is the only tank with a Slashing debuff.

MTQ Tool Tip video

4.0 Embargo Skill changes

Your post is oozing with big indicators that you don't really understand how the job works when played efficiently, and I'll explain why it looks like a really distasteful beg for inappropriate buffs.

Stance Dance costing 25 IB
I don't even understand if you want or don't want to stance dance with this proposal. This is bad for both sides, since 25 is a lower cost than what it could be now but it's also higher than it could be, so you can just spend points and then swap. What is this "change" trying to accomplish?

Berserk
Basically, you're taking a steroid that was buffed from heavensward to stormblood, and you're just asking for more, pointless buffs.
They removed Bloodbath and you're asking them to tie the same effect to Berserk.
You're asking for a flat 33% increase in damage.
You're asking for both critical and direct hit rate to be raised by 10% for the whole duration.
If you don't understand how wrong it is, I don't see how you could expect to be taken seriously.

All combo finishers giving 20 IB
If all combo finishers were to give the same amount of IB, Path would be abandoned.
The 20 IB gain is the point for you to use Path.
Butcher draws enmity and eye is required to be up constantly for the damage dealt buff, while Path allows you to use more Cleaves and Upheavals, but you can't just spam that because you need to keep the Eye buff up, and if you're tanking the boss you need to keep aggro every once in a while.

Onslaught and Upheaval reduce the Infuriate cd like the IB weaponskills
Again, really bad suggestion. the way it is now, you are on the edge of fitting an extra infuriate maybe every 2 minute, but you are just downright asking for free infuriates shamelessly.

Onslaught
Stun? You can just Onslaught Low Blow if you really so desire, you don't have many oGCDs to use anyway.
Potency to 200 would probably make a bit more sense but it'd just be a button to press. You point is fair here, but not really adding much to the job.
10 IB would be a nice change, but it would require the enmity to be removed since it'd be used for dps due to its IB-to-potency value (20 per point, higher than Upheaval's 15 and Cleave's 10), effectively making it a stronger Plunge.

Upheaval
Again, you do have Low Blow. Read your tooltips before jumping to conclusions.
100% direct crit? seriously? This is literally asking for free damage with no drawbacks, since WAR can pretty much just swap for 10s to get a tankbuster and swap out to use that again. There is no value to "just more damage", it's just begging.
They remove a DoT, and you ask for them to tie it in to an ability that already has a point to be used instead of Fell Cleave. Again, begging for damage without a real purpose.
And yet again, Bloodbath is gone. There's better ways to cope with it than repeat a million times that you miss it in a forum thread.

From your conclusion, what you are failing to recognize of the warrior is that it's not an "angry berserker that deals the damage you always dreamt of", it's a berserker that has to keep juggling on the frail line between anger and calmness. That means you're not just going all out and doing damage left and right, you have to keep a hold of your Inner Beast and use it to your advantage without abusing it: that's why I think now, more than ever, warrior truly reflects what it should be.

The point is to have all 3 combos in rotation. As it is currently Storm's Path has priority over all other combos because it give 20 gauge not to mention the self heal, since we lost Bloodbath, will most likely be more important now than ever. If all three combo finishers give 20 gauge then there is more flexibility in the rotation instead of SE combo once then SP combo till slashing/SE debuff refresh. Having an enmity, heal and slashing buff combo all give 30 gauge all together can only be a good thing for WAR.

Bloodbath is not as crucial as you make it out to be. If you are relying on self-heals to stay alive, you are doing it wrong. You should think of self-heals not as a way to survive, but as a way to ease the job on healers during intense sections of fights such as A12S pulling or A11S, when you get vuln up stacks to keep damaging the boss.
Having all combos give the same IB would make Path disappear forever, I can assure you there is absolutely no doubt about that.

Take this reply not as an intent to offend you, rather than as a way to point you toward the really important aspects of the Warrior job.

[Atreides]

Having all combos give the same IB would make Path disappear forever, I can assure you there is absolutely no doubt about that.

I don't think anyone of us would mind that though now that the utility of path is gone it might aswell go away for all I care at last. :|
They did took useful skills from us so why leave us with that piece of garbage?
And no it's not more engaging or challenging either. It's just one more nuisance that adds nothing utility wise.