Is it just me or are people overreacting to WHM too soon?

[Reiryuu]

I don't think people are overreacting to WHM too soon. The WHM backlash is basically a time bomb that has been waiting to explode since 3.0 or, for some, even earlier.

There was an excellent post a while back equating the WHM to the children's book The Giving Tree. I would look for a link to said post, but I fear it has probably been buried somewhere in the giant 134 page (and growing) consolidated WHM feedback thread on the healer forum. I feel it represents many feelings well. WHM has given to other jobs and given to other jobs. Holy was nerfed (which was actually its second time getting nerfed) -- a feeling many scholars are now empathizing with since Bane is now getting hit this patch.

With protect entering the cross-role ability and stoneskin removed, White Mages no longer have a native mitigation skill or shield until level 66 which will make it more difficult for pre-50 white mages leveling up. And even at level 66, this ability requires us to have lilies and consumes them. AST and SCH have full access to theirs.

In its currently proposed state, at level 70, WHM has access to 25 skills, if you consolidate stone and aero that leaves 21. That includes fluid aura which lost its damage component so a WHM would never use it in 50+ content because most mobs are AoE'd post 50 and you don't want to break a mob from the pack and you can't use it for fast damage on bosses anymore. It also includes Repose which, while nice in low level content also sees itself useless post 50 because of the exact same reason. This leaves a white mage with 19 skills that they're actually going to use, +10 potential cross role abilities for a total of 29.

Scholars, consolidating broil and bio, will have access to 25 skills, + 8 Fairy buffs/Abilities (that includes the Fey tether) from Selene and Eos + the 10 cross roles for a total of 43.

Astrologians, consolidating Malefic and Combust, have access to 24 + 8 card effects + 10 cross roles for a total of 42.

That alone is a huge difference. And sure, I hear you, some of those abilites are used to access the effects of others (draw/royal road for cards, summon for faeries), but at least those actions that bring about more actions exist for those two jobs. White mage has nothing that gives it access to more abilities or spells and this is where a lot of the SCH and AST utility comes from.

The vast majority of our 60+ abilities rely on this lily system which is not only RNG at 20%, but it only affects 2 spells: cure and cure II. In most situations, a WHM is not likely to use these spells on targets other than the tank. Yet our level 70 ability also relies on cure and cure II to stack confessions on a target to heal them even more. Most casts of cure or cure II are going to heal your target fully or very nearly full so this extra giant heal really has no use other than on a tank who is constantly getting healed. And the lilies that we generate are most likely going to be consumed at inopportune times as we will want to use Assize, Asylum and Tetra when they're up and they will all eat our lilies to lower their cooldown timers, making it awkward to save them up. All in all it's a bad system that punishes us from using the tools we have at our disposal.

As far as healing goes, AST with its 10% bonus from Diurnal Sect (15% from noct) can now heal better than a WHM and, if I'm not mistaken, shield better than a SCH while still providing excellent party buffs and utility. While these numbers may go down, keep in mind: we're at 13 days until Stormblood early access... or is it just open beta now? Numbers being this far out of whack does not bode well for launch day.

So when confronted to these proposed "Balanced" healers that we were promised-- remember this was supposed to be THE reason healers and tanks weren't getting new jobs this expansion so they could focus on balance-- the pent up frustration is now bursting out. So are WHMs overreacting? No. I don't think so.

[bswpayton]

I don't think people are overreacting to WHM too soon. The WHM backlash is basically a time bomb that has been waiting to explode since 3.0 or, for some, even earlier.

well said so well said

[Aetherstar]

So when confronted to these proposed "Balanced" healers that we were promised-- remember this was supposed to be THE reason healers and tanks weren't getting new jobs this expansion so they could focus on balance-- the pent up frustration is now bursting out. So are WHMs overreacting? No. I don't think so.

This. What you said about this backlash from WHMs being a time bomb since 3.0 is also very much right. I do hope we'll at -least- get some feedback as to why developers have designed the Lily system as such. As it was repeatedly said hundreds of times since the embargo lift and assessment of the changes, good healers never relied on Cure/Cure II (and their other class counterparts) in the duration of ARR+HW unless something went grievously wrong. Maybe we'll get feedback from Yoshida or someone soon. There's still a couple of weeks for an explanation I guess.

[Ayer2015]

snip

IMO, Giving AST access to regen and shields was the first mistake SE made. If they based the job around direct heals, mobility, and their cards, WHM would have retained its identity through HoTs, and SCH through its shields. The way they designed AST is just going to make balancing the existing healers and creating new unique healers difficult.

[KisaiTenshi]

This. It's kind of ironic. The people that SHOULD be mad are the ones being as constructive and detailed about why this new system doesn't work as possible, while the people who don't care are extremely bitter and aggressive to the people complaining.

Did you not see the other 5 threads on the general discussion forum before they were merged sometime earlier today into the 130+ page thread on the healer forum?

People are over-reacting because (raiders) have just been told that they have not been playing WHM the way Yoshi-P designed it to be played. Now they want to complain that "nobody plays that way" when that is untrue, and that other healers (AST and SCH) have more utility. So clearly they want to be playing AST then. WHM doesn't need to become AST.

The two primary complaints that everyone appears to be on the same page for mentioned at some point:

1) Removal of CS stance dancing - It was horrible, we all know it. The only reason it persisted since V1.0 was to allow CNJ/WHM to not be gimped in solo content, and even then you've never been required to use it, just combat takes 4 times longer without it. So this change removes the illogical reason of it existing in the first place.

2) RNGesus based Proc generation is still bad - Even if you play WHM now, Proc's are 15% or 20%, and very common if you use Cure I/Cure II as intended. But because you are relying on seeing that Freecure to cast Cure II, sometimes you're just going to cast Cure II because freecure is there, and sometimes you're going to cast Cure II without because that is what's called. That is not logical at all. Even Medica has a proc, and people forget that it exists because the amount of overhealing medica II creates. So if you're not using the skills frequently, you forget that the Proc's exist.

[MomomiMomi]

People are over-reacting because (raiders) have just been told that they have not been playing WHM the way Yoshi-P designed it to be played. Now they want to complain that "nobody plays that way" when that is untrue, and that other healers (AST and SCH) have more utility. So clearly they want to be playing AST then. WHM doesn't need to become AST.

I guess people were overreacting when they said they didn't want to play BRD the way Yoshi intended them to, as well. Those fools, what were they thinking complaining about that change would get them?

[Ayer2015]

I guess people were overreacting when they said they didn't want to play BRD the way Yoshi intended them to, as well. Those fools, what were they thinking complaining about that change would get them?

On the bright side... you can look forward to WHM being fixed in 2yrs then, if we're using BRD as a the gauge.

[Gemina]

I played AST from day one and it was perfectly capable of healing roulette content before all the buffs. People whined and AST got crazy buffs. Now here we are....

What SE givith, can taketh away. I'm just surprised they continue to givith to AST

[Hamada]

They have been attempting to balance healers for two years and have failed considerably. That does not instill much faith, especially since they seem determined not to nerf things like Balance.

Yeah that is why my faith in them is low. I am happy they are trying to make up for it for 4.0 but...

A self defeating system. Beautiful.

When you get something like this, it shows they only see the small details and not the effect it has on the full picture. Some people wanna play full healer, so they did this to whm. The issue is people do not want this outside a few select people that thank healers shouldn't DPS. For anyone remotely serious about things will just take SCH and AST only. Also if they saw the big picutre, they would not make this self defeating system. I just remembered something from wow. Every time you casted a lightning bolt you got a stack, then when you got 11 stacks you could unleash a huge earthshock (or w/e it was) Why can't they do this for healing? 10 tics of regen/medica = lily. casting 5 cure Is = lily, casting 3 cure IIs = lily, casting 2 cure III=s lily ( so lets say you need 10 "stacks for a lily, a regen tic is 1 stack, a cure I is 2 stacks, a cure II is 3 stacks, (so more like 3 cure IIs + cure I) casting cure III =5 stacks ( so 2 cure IIIs is lily) [adjust exact numbers ofc, just trying to show what I had in mind)

why can't they make a no rng system like that? and don't they play wow????

[Beatrice]

IMO, Giving AST access to regen and shields was the first mistake SE made. If they based the job around direct heals, mobility, and their cards, WHM would have retained its identity through HoTs, and SCH through its shields. The way they designed AST is just going to make balancing the existing healers and creating new unique healers difficult.

I think you hit the nail on the head. I never played AST before until very recently, I've been playing SCH since it was introduced to the game. Given, I was just messing around in PotD but I was like, "Wow, AST gets card buffs, regens, AND shields??? No wonder they're the popular healer."

...Admittedly I'm not that creative but I have a very hard time imagining SE being able to even make another healing class that people would prefer over AST.

And hell, AST is looking so good I might main that in Stormblood instead of SCH! They get cooler AF gear too.