Redo the Crafting system.

[Silverbane]

But it still shows the issue that if you want to do end-game crafting you need a majority of crafting classes at 50 or higher. If you want to make end-game CUL food then guess what; you DO need all 8 classes at 50 or higher! ... something HAS to be done.

Why? I have no complaints with things as they are. So it seems to me that nothing has to be done.

[magnanimousCynic]

snip

Ignoring you purposely editing text to change how my message looks, I don't think needing multiple classes is a massive issue, as it's not the main issue I have.

What I want to see changes happen in is that some Cross-Class skills are outright replacements for other baseline skills, like Careful Synthesis II which replaces Basic Synthesis, not to mention the level 15 version of CS. Another blatant example is Steady Hand II, which replaces Steady Hand I in situations that 20% isn't enough.

The 2nd part of my post is about the skills that are extremely niche to the point of being almost unused (Observation, Rumination outside of low levels, Flawless Synth without Maker's Mark). Most crafters I know don't bother putting Observation on their Hotbar due to how niche it is.

My minimal request from SE is that I want Specialist is to be something more than a stat-stick that lets you makes something one patch faster than others, which they had to give to Specialist to give it incentive. I want Specialism to stop being an example of how SE doesn't know what's good for crafters. I want to see Specialist skills become less RNG reliant so they could fill their original purpose of helping those who DON'T have multiple crafters at 50, which it doesn't since none of the skills are viable replacements for any of our main Cross-Class Skills. If they removed Heart of the Crafter and bumped up the proc rate for Good/Excellent close to what it was back in 2.x, then Specialist Skills could've been more viable.

As a final question, let me ask you this; when was the last time you used Observation?

[MN_14]

If they removed Heart of the Crafter and bumped up the proc rate for Good/Excellent close to what it was back in 2.x, then Specialist Skills could've been more viable.
As a final question, let me ask you this; when was the last time you used Observation?

I don't think bumping the proc rate back up would be a good idea because it'd completely break the balance for both cross class omni-crafters and single class specialist crafters. What they really need is a new mechanic to influence your wheel stacks, not good procs, which can be used for massive CP recovery or PT. The current rates are actually balanced for an omni-crafter to get just enough good procs to craft a 4* from 0-100% on an average run.

The spec abilities are massively overpowered at lower level recipes because of high proc rates. I know that some players had issues with crafting the master 2 tokens with only a single class at 60, but they would have breezed through them had they tried using the spec abilities. I've tried them myself with the following:

- level 60
- ~430 craftsmanship and control
- 400 CP
- no cross class skills except the level 15 ones of which I only used a handful
- spec abilities: whistle, satisfaction, nymeia's wheel, byregot's miracle

And the results absolutely shocked me:

- Used whistle, satisfaction, TOT for CP recovery and nymeia's wheel for cheaper durability restores when appropriate
- Generally most runs had me using HT a whopping 18-21 times, which gives you no problems building 11 stacks of IQ under SH1 with several touches on top of that, without even considering PT. You get back so much CP that you're drowning in it
- Clearly overpowered on a single class basis, never-mind multi-class

They really need to remove the link between whistle stack reduction and possible use of TOT.

As a side note, I don't know about other crafters but I actually do use observe somewhat regularly. There have been a number of situations where my quality fell a bit short and where I had excess CP but did not have any other better ability to use as a bait for a good proc. It isn't as effective as in ARR when the proc rates were higher, but it's allowed me to bump my results up to 100% on numerous occasions. It's not something I would use even a quarter of the time, but it's a skill that I'm definitely mindful of.

As for FS, well without Maker's Mark, it really is only a "training ability" that is useful for leveling other crafting classes when the 40 progress given by FS exceeded other options. Maker's Mark was introduced for the very reason of giving it more relevance.

[Silverbane]

As a final question, let me ask you this; when was the last time you used Observation?

I just did, and got a Good proc for my Byregot's. HQ Cotton Yarn, Yay!
So, since that was you're "final question," bye!

LOL

[Caimie_Tsukino]

I just did, and got a Good proc for my Byregot's. HQ Cotton Yarn, Yay!
So, since that was you're "final question," bye!

LOL

Observation is a great skill. But I think it should cost way less than 14 CP... I think 6 to 7 CP would be a more reasonable cost. How would you see this?

[Silverbane]

Observation is a great skill. But I think it should cost way less than 14 CP... I think 6 to 7 CP would be a more reasonable cost. How would you see this?

The key cost point is 8CP. If it's less than 8CP, it becomes useful for shortening Comfort Zone. And that is useful: I've had rotations that were one CZ step and 1 or 2 CP short of working; putting in a 6CP Observation would have made them work (effectively shortening the CZ to 9 steps while reducing the total CP gain to 8.) Similarly, a CZ chain with 2 6CP Observations would effectively be 8 steps and a 2 CP gain.

Add in the possibility of a ToT proc, and it becomes darn right attractive.

[Dre777]

I've grinded through every gear progression since 2.0 launch. I have loved every aspect of the craft/gather system. I wish the specialist system worked out better, it had potential. I hope it gets revamped and implemented in SB. My only gripe is not the crafting system but the mb, I would like to see a gated undercut system that allows undercutting only once per an hour per an item. This would give other players that have busy lives the chance to make Gil and progress. Let's face it crafting cost allot to level and gear up. I'm gonna have about 200mil at SB launch, not being smug just try to express my experience. So, let's see undercuts gated for all the other players that don't work from home like me and can't undercut every 10mins like I can. SE you listening?

[Dre777]

Obviously this would only work if you could have only one of an item up at time (2, HQ/NQ).

[ChameleonMS]

Most crafters I know don't bother putting Observation on their Hotbar due to how niche it is....As a final question, let me ask you this; when was the last time you used Observation?

I still have it on my hotbars but I cannot remember the last time I need to use it.

If poor shows up on BB it almost never affects me because:
1. I used BB on the previous excellent; assuming GS was up.
Or,
2. When I have CZ / CP miscalculation; I almost always plan out my completion to require 2 touches at the end. This allows me to use CSII on the Poor and take BB on next step.

The spec abilities are massively overpowered at lower level recipes because of high proc rates.

Being overpowered on low level crafts is a waste. Specialist abilities need to competive at top tier recipes to matter at all.

Observation is a great skill. But I think it should cost way less than 14 CP... I think 6 to 7 CP would be a more reasonable cost. How would you see this?

The key cost point is 8CP. If it's less than 8CP, it becomes useful for shortening Comfort Zone.

I would think 10CP would be better choice. It would not allow for a free step under CZ but it would very, very cheap.

[MrHobbit]

lol ffxiv crafting system is great whats not great is the specialist system hahaha ffxiv got one of the best if not the best crafting systems on the mmo market.