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  1. #1
    Player
    Transient_Shadow's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    638
    Character
    Flutter Butter
    World
    Malboro
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 90

    The other extreme

    Ok. i'm not sure what it is with people. You've got people who refuse to dps to the extreme and now aparantly you have people who refuse to heal to the extreme! I mean I'm a sch if a healer ever had a rotation it would be put some dots on or use stone then top your team off. Not leave them half dead the entire run!

    How hard is it to dps AND heal? you don't have to do one over the other save for the instance of either high damage instances or a poor party.
    (1)

  2. #2
    Player
    Rawrz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Posts
    1,704
    Character
    Sir Rawrz
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 90
    Why top someone off when everyone has a natural regen. Heal on a non active battle time? of course! When active though, if the dps arent going to be in danger, theres no need to heal them. Understanding rate of damage is half of a healers role. Might as well sit my controller down and tie my shoes in a dungeon. Equally as relevant as topping off someone who wasnt in danger of dying.
    (8)

  3. #3
    Player
    Sylvain's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    1,491
    Character
    Sylvestre Solscribe
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Rawrz View Post
    Why top someone off when everyone has a natural regen. Heal on a non active battle time? of course! When active though, if the dps arent going to be in danger, theres no need to heal them. Understanding rate of damage is half of a healers role. Might as well sit my controller down and tie my shoes in a dungeon. Equally as relevant as topping off someone who wasnt in danger of dying.
    While this is not a practice I actively do, I think you're right.

    But I would be cautious with such practice, as you pointed, if you know absolutely Nothing is going to happen, in fact, why waste your time healing when you could help finish the boss.
    On the other hand, if someone die because of that, even if is technically their fault for failing a mechanic, the little dps you will have pulled over the 2.5sec it would have taken to top the dps is not worth it.
    I think of the "do not move" mechanic from the spider boss in Baelsar Wall or the big cleave from Griffin. If one dps dies because I choose to do 1-2 more MaleficII instead of topping them right away, while it's technically their fault, I'm also to blame as my choice will result in his death and less overall group dps.

    Of course, this is considering pug situation with people you don't know.
    At the contrario, when my friend tanks he informs me if he's gonna pop invincibility or if he'll ever need any heal. Knowing that, I'll spam gravity to get faster.
    I'll be much more conservative and careful with a pug tank that doesn't talk.

    But fundamentaly, Rawrz is right. If there's better window to heal people and they're safe even at low health, you might as well use those Windows (for instance, Bismark shell, technically no one should die while we are all dpsing, everyone falls very low though, but there's no need for heal at this moment)
    (3)

  4. #4
    Player
    Cynfael's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    2,164
    Character
    Sacrilege Moonshadow
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Transient_Shadow View Post
    How hard is it to dps AND heal? you don't have to do one over the other save for the instance of either high damage instances or a poor party.
    This I can agree with completely. The failure of some players to understand the interplay of healing and DPS actions contributes to a lot of the drama on healer forums.

    As for underhealing, like Rawrz says, there are times where you literally don't need to heal the wounded, but it if you're talking about healers who are flat out negligent, that's a different story. Sometimes I see this from players who seem to be healing 100% on reaction and react slowly.
    (2)

  5. #5
    Player
    Thunda_Cat_SMASH's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    2,105
    Character
    Sylvana Tenebri
    World
    Malboro
    Main Class
    Marauder Lv 79
    Quote Originally Posted by Transient_Shadow View Post
    How hard is it to dps AND heal? you don't have to do one over the other save for the instance of either high damage instances or a poor party.
    But then I can't tease and joke with people anymore.
    (0)

  6. #6
    Player
    Gemina's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Dravania
    Posts
    5,778
    Character
    Gemina Lunarian
    World
    Siren
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 100
    I see this as a matter of players need to trust their healers and let them do what they do. A knowledgeable healer is always assessing how quickly the damage is coming and adjusts their threshold for healing accordingly. If the healer feels there is no immediate risk of a KO, then the DPS window remains open. Over-healing may not necessarily be a sign of a bad healer; it actually can be more indicative that your healer doesn't trust their group.

    My rule of thumb for DPS players is that they have enough health to survive a hit. They have lower HP pools than the tank, so single cures restore a greater percentage of their health, and it actually irks me a little bit if I actually have to use a cure spell on a DPS player outside of scripted damage they take. Regens and fairy should be enough to keep them up.

    Tanks are a different story. The over-geared ones have such ridiculous health pools, and take so little damage that keeping them at 40-50% really isn't much different than keeping them at 90-95%. This changes obviously depending on how well the tank is geared and content played. Sub par tanks need constant healing, and a healer doing their job will remain out of Cleric to do so.
    (3)
    Last edited by Gemina; 05-28-2017 at 11:36 PM.

  7. #7
    Player
    winsock's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    788
    Character
    Chaosgrimm Winsock
    World
    Adamantoise
    Main Class
    Conjurer Lv 60
    The goal of healing is to keep people above 0 hp, not at 100% hp. Dont worry about it unless people are dieing.
    (4)

  8. #8
    Player
    Zojha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Posts
    3,565
    Character
    Lodestone Bait
    World
    Pandaemonium
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 1
    Quote Originally Posted by winsock View Post
    The goal of healing is to keep people above 0 hp, not at 100% hp. Dont worry about it unless people are dieing.
    Or as someone else once put it: The only health point that matters is the last.

    Bosses like to teach you that fact when they wipe the group in what seems to be their death throes at 1%. You tried so hard, you got so far, but... y'know.
    (3)

  9. #9
    Player
    Lukha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    Goblet W13P13, Ul'Dah
    Posts
    1,455
    Character
    Lukh'a Lybhica
    World
    Adamantoise
    Main Class
    Conjurer Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Transient_Shadow View Post
    Not leave them half dead the entire run!
    Half dead is still not dead. If you have even 1 hp left, I am doing my job as healer.

    Not that I've ever purposely let a tank's HP drop as low as possible before saving them just to scare them or anything; that would be mean. Even if some tanks really need to be reminded who's the boss.
    (1)

  10. #10
    Player
    Sylvain's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    1,491
    Character
    Sylvestre Solscribe
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Gemina View Post
    Over-healing may not necessarily be a sign of a bad healer; it actually can be more indicative that your healer doesn't trust their group.
    .
    Haha! This is so true.
    I recall one day a mate being like "It's fun to do dungeon with you, I always have a shield and Stoneskin on"
    I was like "yeah, don't worry I got ya!". But the Truth was that he was so bad at dodging that I had to keep shield + stoneskin. *cought* BLM *cough*
    (1)
    Last edited by Sylvain; 05-29-2017 at 07:04 PM.

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