I think SAM will be like MNK and I'm okay with that.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Unfortunately, if they do go that route, it won't seen much love in the raid scene. Someone did a rather in-depth analysis on the frequency of each role and Monk fell considerably shorter than every other DPS job. They simply don't do enough raw damage to offset their lack of utility. I mean, this tier alone, even Bard started to catch up to Monk despite being vastly more useful to the raid. The devs really need to reconsider how buffs work to better encourage non-meta comps.

[aleph_null]

I think one potential problem with raising mnk's personal dps to offset against other jobs' dps utilities is that it might become too OP for 4 man contents where dps utilities aren't as powerful as in 8 man contents due to lack of people and "incomplete" composition. I personally don't care about this, considering we already have smn being OP in dungeons anyway, but I wonder what the devs think about it. Imo jobs should be balanced against each other in the most difficult contents, but some might disagree.

[NovaLevossida]

I hope SAM has a sensible system to its design. MNK is just a recipe for carpal tunnel with chakra building and form shifting when there's nothing to hit. I'm on board with it being a powerhouse, especially if it has one or two cast time abilities via sword drawing arts.

I think one potential problem with raising mnk's personal dps to offset against other jobs' dps utilities is that it might become too OP for 4 man contents where dps utilities aren't as powerful as in 8 man contents due to lack of people and "incomplete" composition. I personally don't care about this, considering we already have smn being OP in dungeons anyway, but I wonder what the devs think about it. Imo jobs should be balanced against each other in the most difficult contents, but some might disagree.

Is there any 4-man content outside of high floor POTD that's actually difficult enough that it matters? That's like saying no one wants a NIN for expert roulette because SMN exists. Maybe true, but it's not like NINs aren't getting into expert roulettes.

[aleph_null]

Is there any 4-man content outside of high floor POTD that's actually difficult enough that it matters? That's like saying no one wants a NIN for expert roulette because SMN exists. Maybe true, but it's not like NINs aren't getting into expert roulettes.

Not that I know of. I was just stating a possible (from dev's pov) problem with too much personal dps difference between jobs.

[Allyrion]

As a monk, I don't approve of this.

This is just a difference of opinion though. I might main MNK but I don't support having a dps that is just better damage and no utility. I love how MNK plays and that's always the most important thing, but the lack of utility always bothered me.
I think every dps should bring something to a group and those utilities balanced overall.

All those types of buffs have been mostly unique so it's not like I'm asking for homogenization, quite the opposite.
How different utilities/buffs work with each other makes for interesting raid synergy. It's great when every dps pays it forward.

I've been okay enough with MNK despite all that, and if I play SAM and it is similar, I will be okay too.
But I'd certainly prefer if either weren't 'selfish' dps in Stormblood.

[Fireselecta]

Hmmmm, I think people tend to forget mnk's real raid utility... I mean, except world 1st PGMs and all those crazy players with crazy skills :
- Do you remember AS3 (without echo) without a mnk ? DK debuff was like REALLY usefull for progression purposes. I took this fight in example since it was a true hard fight. But that's the same for AS4 and AS8.
- Having a Mantra can save few people in any fight, especially in progression phases...
- It also increase Ifrit damages (no, okay, I joke ^^)

But all this to say, mnk isn't useless ! It's only not the best choice for speedruns. But once you take it for progression, mnk is way more usefull than drg/nin, since you may prefer to learn mechanics before going full deeps (no need to say, there wasn't any true dps check in Alex Savage)

So if SAM is just a powerhouse with heal/tank utility, i'm pretty fine with it too

[aleph_null]

The problem when you try to compare defensive vs offensive utilities is that defensive utilities' value diminishes very quickly as you overgear. Dragon kick is replacable with delirium (the mitigation effect), mantra is valuable mostly only during early progression with low ilv. Some of the world first clear groups used mnk for the defensive utilities: mnk for a7s (also pld), and a8s if I recall correctly, but once you overgear the content enough you don't need those defensive utilities so the jobs with offensive utilities become the objectively better choices.

I'm also quite sure a3s early clear groups didn't bring mnk since the main problem with early a3s clear is the dps check (at least the world first group brought drg/nin instead). Dragon kick mitigation can be replaced by delirium so nothing's lost by not bringing mnk there.

[RaizeGraymalkin]

So here's a great write up on Reddit for the SAM and it's abilities/mechanics. Someone should make an official SAM topic at some point with this info. All credit to Eyphio on the XIV subreddit.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...z3XlmZXLs/edit

Sounds really fun!

[SenorKanga]

I think it's more about how it's seen by the raid community at large than anything else. As crap as it is to have one member decide that they didn't want a monk who was pure dps, it would definitely be useful to pander and take away that excuse.

[Valenth]

From what we've seen in the Live Letter now, I'm even more excited about it. I love how we have some increased SkS, but not entirely as fast as NIN or MNK, how we have buffs and debuff into our combos and a gauge system to unleash a flurry variety of attacks with. I love how it has a little build up feel to it like monk with the Sen, but diversity a little more like ninja with the Kenki gauge. I also like how it does seem to have plenty of positionals as I like moving around in combat, but they matter more for the Kenki building rather than the dmg from the actual used skills. Looking forward to executing all those clean cuts too.