Viera as the next new race~ Show your support

[Vexander]

they should not add race at all atm. especially not to pander some audience that already plays their game and has enough options on animal girls. Rather they should do more customizable for character creator which is a much more needed point in aesthetics or etablish more clan options which is something that is terrible underused imo

You've made your opinion know loudly and frequently already. Perhaps its time to leave the thread? It's purpose is to discuss the addition of Viera, not a thread to discuss never adding another new playable race and everything Square could do instead of that. If you'd like to discuss that, why not make another thread for it? I'm sure you'd have a lot of people supporting an agenda of adding more customization options to the existing races. That's something I'm in favor of as well. I'm also just in favor of new races. I feel like Square didn't add the Au Ra correctly to be honest. They would've done better to hold off on making them playable until Stormblood, the expansion where they're relevant to the story and we have a lot of in-game opportunities to learn about them.

That said, adding Viera or any new race might be something best held off on until we visit Meracydia or the New World to the West, that large unexplored continent the Mamoolja come from. Or perhaps Radz-at-Han. Really, there are a lot of places we could find new races.

[Ghastly]

I feel like there's a bit of irony in there somewhere coming from a roe and all. Together, roegadyn and elezen make up roughly 11-15% of all characters. Again, that's together. Separately, Roes average about 5% and Elezen average about 8%.

So, by your same logic, assuming we're talking about FFXII Viera here, why should they bother adding a race even remotely similar to the two least popular races in the game? By your same logic, it literally only makes sense to make Viera into another small, cute, petitie race like Miqo'te and Au Ra.

So, new question, do people honestly not care if Viera are "miqo'te/au ra types" with bunny ears? And if not, why stop there? they may as well add waifu foxes, dogs, and whatever else they can come up with.

After all, nothing says diversity quite like reskins.

Your part about me being roegadyn doesn't affect the galka point. There's a big difference between the races an mmo starts with and the ones that are added later. The ones that are added later are most of the time based on how popular they will be with the players. Au ra for example is for the japanese players and ended up being famous here also. Yoshida even talked about how popular viera are in the West. To summarize, roegadyn and races that are not popular are there because they need to be there for those that want something unique and will be played by some. This works the same way that jobs work. Classes like monk might not be popular but it's fine to add them at the start. After that when they're adding new jobs they only consider what the fans want (dark knight, samurai, etc).

As for your fox statement it really doesn't make sense to make animal-based races besides viera since they don't meet a requirement for adding a new race. Adding a new race is either based on being unique (and wanted) or being a classic race in the series (and wanted). Au ra met the first requirement, viera meets the second.

Does that sound familiar to how they add jobs? Dark knight is classic in the series, astrologian/mch are unique to the game.

Why have 2 sword tanks? Because they're classic jobs and people like them. Why add viera while we have miqo'te? Because they're classic and people like them.


I back up every statement that I make. I would like to see those opposed to adding viera to actually back up their statements because just opposing them without any reason besides I don't like them is getting really tiring and really shows how little thought they put into their opposition.

This in turn should prove to the devs that the ones opposed to the class have no real basis besides their own dislike and not because of a real reason.
Want more beastial race? Impossible in FFXIV
Want them not added? Make a thread for it, it works better than in a Show your support for viera thread. There's actually one opposing the viera, your voices would be better heard there.
Don't have a reason besides I don't like them? Why not state it once instead of repeating the same baseless reason 20 times? I don't like them isn't a legitimate reason, it's only an opinion.

You've made your opinion know loudly and frequently already. Perhaps its time to leave the thread? It's purpose is to discuss the addition of Viera, not a thread to discuss never adding another new playable race and everything Square could do instead of that. If you'd like to discuss that, why not make another thread for it? I'm sure you'd have a lot of people supporting an agenda of adding more customization options to the existing races. That's something I'm in favor of as well. I'm also just in favor of new races. I feel like Square didn't add the Au Ra correctly to be honest. They would've done better to hold off on making them playable until Stormblood, the expansion where they're relevant to the story and we have a lot of in-game opportunities to learn about them.

That said, adding Viera or any new race might be something best held off on until we visit Meracydia or the New World to the West, that large unexplored continent the Mamoolja come from. Or perhaps Radz-at-Han. Really, there are a lot of places we could find new races.

Waiting until new continent is added is a big mistake. By the time we visit a new continent outside the current map FFXIV will be at the end of its run, barely with 3 years left by the time a Meracydia/new world expansion is made.

They can come from those locations to eorzea but to wait to go there won't add any value to the use of having them. The lore would work better, but practical/playwise it would be too far into FFXIV's lifecycle.

[Benjo]

Please, not another generic Hyur with _insert body modification here_ .

Right now only Roegadyn is the only unique race while the others are more or less copycats Q_Q

[Galaktica]

snip

A couple months ago, you showed off the new race, the Au Ra… but you also showed concept art of the Viera, who appeared in Final fantasy XII and other games. Why did you decide against their inclusion as a playable race?

The issue with the Viera is that, if you look at them, they're basically humanoid save for their long rabbit ears and their heels. We already have a mostly humanoid race with animal ears in the Mi'qote. When we looked at those initial Viera concepts, it just seemed like a Mi'qote with bunny ears instead of cat ears. It simply wasn't different enough. Especially when we did the male designs… they didn't look beastly enough, they were just a little too cute. We wanted to make something that was original to the Final Fantasy series, and to do that, we decided to step away from the Viera.


I was actually strongly against showing the Viera concept art at the event we unveiled the Au Ra at. I knew that people would be like “why didn't you include them?!” [laughs] We feel we have a good thing with the Au Ra, though. If you don't like them, though, let us know and we'll take it into consideration with the next race we bring in.

Source

And I'm sorry, but you can't reduce the opposition to "just an opinion." Don't start that mess. That's what this whole thread is. Opinions. Viera don't deserve to be in the game more than anything else. Just because people want them doesn't make it a legitimate reason. I don't care how much support they get.

People were in favor of bigger butts. Does that mean those deserve to take up development time? People want Cloud's bike and the car-that-I-can't-remember-the-name-of from FFXV. Better add those too, eh? I bet people would freaking love to walk around the nude. Better get the dev team on it!

Your opinion is worth just as much or as little as everyone else's whether you like it or not.

[Ghastly]

Source

And I'm sorry, but you can't reduce the opposition to "just an opinion." Don't start that mess. That's what this whole thread is. Opinions. Viera don't deserve to be in the game more than anything else. Just because people want them doesn't make it a legitimate reason. I don't care how much support they get.

People were in favor of bigger butts. Does that mean those deserve to take up development time? People want Cloud's bike and the car-that-I-can't-remember-the-name-of from FFXV. Better add those too, eh? I bet people would freaking love to walk around the nude. Better get the dev team on it!

Your opinion is worth just as much or as little as everyone else's whether you like it or not.

You're too agitated now for no reason.

First of all, understand what adding a new race is. Adding a new race in a new expansion is as natural as adding a new job. It's one of the defining features of a new expansion. It's not as simplistic as adding cloud's bike. As for adding butt slider, that has as much weight as adding viera does because character customization again one of the core features of a new expansion. There are things that will always be asked for in expansions and you can narrow it down to new job, new race, more character customization with your eyes closed.

So when you say weigh our support for viera against cloud's bike you're not weighing them sincerely and with thought. More character customization on the other hand has the same kind of weight.

It's just like when trying to prove something in court. There's weight to the things you're trying to persuade with, it's not a yes or no answer. You're simplifying a discussion to a yes or no choice when those of us in support are giving you the opportunity to make the conversation deeper and with more proof to your stance.

I bring weight to my stance on them adding a new race (the most popular one being viera). What weight do you bring?

To further my point look at what Yoshida said in your quote "We feel we have a good thing with the Au Ra, though. If you don't like them, though, let us know and we'll take it into consideration with the next race we bring in." He's already asking us to support "the next race we bring in"

Adding a new race in an expansion is such a high demand that they always address it during an expansion with "no new race this expansion" or "yes: new race is"
Because they know the demand behind this "opinion"

They wouldn't do that for cloud's bike

[Galaktica]

You're too agitated now for no reason.

First of all, understand what adding a new race is. Adding a new race in a new expansion is as natural as adding a new job. It's one of the defining features of a new expansion.

Except...it's not? Statistically, if you look back over every MMO expansion, you'll find that new races are rare. WoW is probably the most frequent with them seemingly adding a new every other expansion (I assume XIV will follow that trend), but they're the outliers.

And for like billionth time, you know what the opposition stands for. Me, plenty of other players, and some guy called Yoshida all feel like Viera would be too similar to several races that are currently in the game. That's why we don't want them. We want something different or just most customization options for what we already have. However, for some reason, you and a bunch of other people have just randomly decided that that's not a valid point of view for some inane reason. Why? If people can ask for Viera "just because." why can't we ask for something else "just because."

Suddenly we need ro write thesis statements? If anyone is simplifying anything, it's you. It's literally you. People have told you time and time again why they don't want Viera, and in great detail I might add, but you all just put your fingers in your ear and are like "nah, come up with a different reason please."

[Vexander]

We want something different or just most customization options for what we already have. However, for some reason, you and a bunch of other people have just randomly decided that that's not a valid point of view for some inane reason. Why? If people can ask for Viera "just because." why can't we ask for something else "just because."

Not to get into the argument but, again, why not start another thread? You don't need to start a thesis paper or anything, but you can try to address certain issues that would inevitably crop up with the idea of a new race. Say you start a thread asking for... I dunno. Tigon. A race of Bipedal tiger people with the heads of tigers and the tails. You'd need to address concerns such as how armor and weapons appear on them, for starters. You could argue you'd base the model on, say, Roegadyn, using the Miqo'te stance, with tweaks to both. How would hairstyles work on them? How do you address sexual dimorphism? Are we going Thundercats? Or full-blown Furry? A mix based on Gender? What customization options do you offer? Keep to stripes or offer spots as well, perhaps that being the difference between two Clans?

I'm all for people making discussions about things they like, but there's this weird aversion to making a new thread on these forums, it feels like.

[Kaitoo]

N

simple

first off, as you know, it was participant of this thread who wanted to know what people having against viera inclusion

second off, as you stated, this is a forum. When someone makes a thread its for trading opinions, and not circle jerking to one. Thats like saying when someone makes a thread "healer dps should be removed" instead of discussing the pro and cons in the thread they should rather go and make a thread "healer dps should not be removed" which is childish and not the function of a forum

[Galaktica]

I'm all for people making discussions about things they like, but there's this weird aversion to making a new thread on these forums, it feels like.

Personally, there's a bunch of reasons why I don;t want to make a new thread. Most notably, it feels like trying to shoo away any and all criticism and/or like trying to turn this into some weird safe space. Like you (not you specifically, Vex, but just a general sorta you) only want people who agree with you because that supports your argument and I don't think that's helpful for anyone. Challenging each others ideas are how progress is made. If we all just go to our separate corners and never interact with other, it just turns into an echochamber with everyone patting each other on the back regardless of any flaws in logic.

Second, it's only going to be used as ammunition. Any time someone brings up Viera again, you know damn well the conversation is going to go like "the thread supporting Viera has almost 100 pages, but the one asking for something else only has X number of pages. I think it's clear what the people want Yoshi! Viera plz! ty"

Third, mods don't seem to mind so I assume it's okaty.

And lastly, we're 90 pages into this mess. There's no turning back now.

[Ghastly]

Except...it's not? Statistically, if you look back over every MMO expansion, you'll find that new races are rare. WoW is probably the most frequent with them seemingly adding a new every other expansion (I assume XIV will follow that trend), but they're the outliers.

And for like billionth time, you know what the opposition stands for. Me, plenty of other players, and some guy called Yoshida all feel like Viera would be too similar to several races that are currently in the game. That's why we don't want them. We want something different or just most customization options for what we already have. However, for some reason, you and a bunch of other people have just randomly decided that that's not a valid point of view for some inane reason. Why? If people can ask for Viera "just because." why can't we ask for something else "just because."

Suddenly we need ro write thesis statements? If anyone is simplifying anything, it's you. It's literally you. People have told you time and time again why they don't want Viera, and in great detail I might add, but you all just put your fingers in your ear and are like "nah, come up with a different reason please."

Who's stopping you from talking about beast tribe races? Can you find an instance of where that happened?
The first people who play the victim card are the ones who lost the argument.

And you can quote Yoshida 100 times, and 100 times he said "We feel we have a good thing with the Au Ra, though. If you don't like them, though, let us know and we'll take it into consideration with the next race we bring in."

But go ahead, talk about what race you want, we're listening.