Suggestion as to how to get people to become healers.

[Faliandra]

Your thread title suggests there arent enough healers.
But there are.


The real problem is more like "How to get people to ´become good healers".
Also, as an avid dps healer myself, I'm not sure I like this suggestion. It takes away a challenge/risk some of us like.

If they removed the cleric stance and added in your suggestion, I would like to think it would get rid of the issue in the community about healer DPS. More healers would dps if they didn't have to stance dance and risk letting someone die in the mean time.

Just my opinion on the matter.

And I bet you, some are still gonna refuse it as a matter of principle. And some are still gonna be like "But, but...the tank could miraculously get one-shotted and die while I'm in the middle of casting Stone II for 2 seconds"

The people who would dps more without cleric stance are the people who would eventually start dpsing anyway once they feel more comfortable.
Only difference I expect here is that they might be inclined to start dpsing sooner because the risk/penalty of cleric stance is gone.

[MisterLucie]

It takes away a challenge/risk some of us like.

I hear this a lot and I really don't agree with it. There's nothing particularly "challenging" about utilizing cleric stance. Healing requirements in end game content in this game are designed very lazily, typically with very predictable damage patterns and long periods of either completely negligible or solo healable damage. Do a fight one time and you'll know when you can and cannot safely be in cleric every single time after that.

It's an illusion of challenge that simply exists to satisfy SE's penchant for complication.

[Faliandra]

I hear this a lot and I really don't agree with it. There's nothing particularly "challenging" about utilizing cleric stance. Healing requirements in end game content in this game are designed very lazily, typically with very predictable damage patterns and long periods of either completely negligible or solo healable damage. Do a fight one time and you'll know when you can and cannot safely be in cleric every single time after that.

It's an illusion of challenge that simply exists to satisfy SE's penchant for complication.

I love hearing this kind of argument from people who dont even seem to do endgame content.

It may apply for statics,because people tend to keep doing the same thing over and over again once they found a way that works.
But a lot of time windows for healer dps are actually created by the tanks themselves and when and how they use their cooldowns.


And these are sometimes quite different from each other, and you'll see different ways to deal with stuff when you PF them regularly.

[MisterLucie]

It may apply for statics,because people tend to keep doing the same thing over and over again once they found a way that works.

Yes, typically when someone discusses challenging content they're speaking of new, progression encounters they're doing with a reliable and competent group, not stale PUG content you're doing in PF three weeks later.

So yes, my stance that a healer will know when they can and cannot use Cleric is based on the assumption they're in a competent group.

[Faliandra]

Yes, typically when someone discusses challenging content they're speaking of new, progression encounters they're doing with a reliable and competent group, not stale PUG content you're doing in PF three weeks later.

So yes, my stance that a healer will know when they can and cannot use Cleric is based on the assumption they're in a competent group.

But PF is still PF and you will always have more and less competent groups. You cant only base off your assumptions on statics. Not everyone has time for statics.

I dont always do the exact same amount of dps and sometimes there are more opportunities to dps than in other runs.
Sometimes, I feel in a more risky mood than others and try to dish out another additional spell where I normally wouldnt.

There are super safe windows to do dps, but trying to go beyond that is all about guesstimating whether you can get away with it without the tank dying or not.

Again: go get there yourself before you try to speak on behalf of others.

[delukard7]

Tbh as a tank i don´t mind when healers just heal.
I´m a legacy player on a new account. I have done a lot of tanking, and i remember only needing the healer to cleric dance, when the dps aren't doing enough damage.
Like on those old brayflox runs .

[TaleraRistain]

Like on those old brayflox runs .

Speaking of Brayflox runs, I remember when I was a baby white mage that we were actually expected to use Repose on the big boss in the second fight.

[Mithron]

Stance dancing is literally one of my favorite things about this game is the main reason why I love playing healer, especially WHM, so much. I agree it could be more intuitive, responsive, and have better UI attached, but it definitely needs to remain a core part of playing healer in this game and should be expected.

[FeliciaTheSecond]

Stance dancing is literally one of my favorite things about this game is the main reason why I love playing healer, especially WHM, so much.

This. I'm in the same boat. I main WHM and love it mainly because I love seeing how much damage I can dish out while running dungeons. People underestimate healer dps. A lot of people just assume its not worth the effort but checking the numbers I usually do about 70ish% of an actual dps class on average. And before you say "Oh those are just bad dps", no I actually outdps the "bad" dps as sad as that is. I really hope they don't do too much to change cleric stance as I like the way it works as is.

The people saying "Oh just remove it and let damage scale off MND". I kind of feel like it would be way too OP if they did that. My worst fear is if they DO do something like that, that they'll nerf healer damage into the ground to compensate.

[Nyxn607]

I would think that if they made healer's have more buffing capabilities, then it would help get rid of this whole healer DPS argument going around. It might just create a new argument about how they are not buffing properly, but what would this game be if people didn't complain about healers?

My thought is this, back when I played EQ and even WoW healers had an average of 3-5 buffs they could give everyone. In EQ Shamans had certain buffs along the lines of an AST's balance that would only last 30 seconds to a minute or two. So a Shaman as the example would have to balance the buffs with the healing needed. This is something that could be easily implement especially with AST, where more buffs could be added, but without the RNG and keeping the timers aligned with the current durations in FFXIV. EQ and even WoW also had more poison(s)/disease/curses that needed to be cleansed. EQ in particular had certain skills that only healer's had that were a necessity for certain raids as they would prevent enrage or cancel/reduce the mechanics needed. Just a few examples that could help alleviate the down time of healers in FFXIV.

Now don't get me wrong, I don't imagine it would eliminate the cry babies issues, but it would help to reduce the amount of downtime a healer has if the buffs had short enough timers. Outside of the buffs, the only other feasible fix that would come from the developers would be to change the way mobs fight. For example adding in simple debuff mechanics, or simply make them do more damage.