Split SCH and SMN already! The poblems are just going to keep increasing!!!

[BigRed5392]

cutters cry is 38 so you are wrong, do that at 38 sch and tell me how well that works out for you.

This is clearly an oversight because of an outdated system that had no business in being in 2.0+

selene has a party wide esuna skill. It was changed from something else.

[Ririta]

A split opens up room for Summoner to behave closer to being an actual Summoner, instead of an awkward poison-debuffing class with pets. I've even drafted up a proposal of how Summoner could get overhauled if this were to happen, though be aware I don't actually play Summoner.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/hfuyzt5reh...rhaul.rtf?dl=0

All that I need to feel as an actual summoner is new pets (at least the classic 3 remaining) and for Dreadwyrm Trance (rename it to Astral Flow ) to make my pet become the real deal to unleash an attack like Judgement Bolt.

I don't like their idea of turning us into gimp black mages, that's not the class fantasy.

[Eloah]

Okay, I didnt read each post because its all going to be the same stuff we've heard before. But here are the key points for right now, they wanted to make more split classes like SCH and SMN, but realized that they backed themselves into a corner, that they would need time to get out of. For right now the split is staying and they are maintaining the balance very well. And the extra stat points you get dont mean much in end game. Don't say it does because i checked, and will check again in SB. Oh and don't sneak any of that, "with the split we can get a real summoner" shite, yeah, no. This, THIS, is the FFXIV SMN. There is no true or real Summoner, the only qualifications are that it summons, and hey guess what it does. So stop, just stop.

Now to the OP, are you serious, you know changes are coming but you couldn't hold your "complaining" until after Stormblood. They are adding role skills, you dont think Esuna could be a part of that. I cant say for sure though.

Also you know you get an "esuna" skill, at roughly the same time as Esuna, I'll let you figure out where it is.

Oh and for your information Grimoires are the default Scholar weapon, like claws for monks and spears for dragoons, SMN never used books, but tge books make sense for them in general.

I will add one additional thing, Truely good healers can heal through the pain, with minimum effort.

[Feidam]

It would be nice to get leeches earlier, but ultimately it's not a huge deal when the group plays as they should. I.e. Not ignoring mechanics and derping the boss Aoe's just because they can't be bothered with the lower level dungeon mechanics. Also, I suspect that will be a role ability.

[Gemina]

This is for the crazy min/max players. How many people in this game actually do that. Your points are valid yes, but it doesn't change the fact that all 35 points in int on sch isn't game changing. I play smn and sch both and the points are needed more in smn than sch. The fairy scales more off gear than mind so healing isn't an issiue(I've solo healed A11 normal when it first came out).

Again, keeping groups healed isn't the issue. Your fairy will normally take care of 65-90% of healing throughout the game's content anyway. Your DPS and shield potency goes down though. The 35 points is basically a piece of gear you're missing. You are right that it is not game changing, but the SCH who allocates their points correctly is going to hit harder and their shields will be more potent than the one who doesn't. I'm not even a min/max player, and I don't raid. I swap the points because it is VERY easy to do. It is inconvenient. I totally get that, which is why I don't swap every time I switch between the two jobs. Just when entering instances with other players.

[Airget]

We've been asking for this for over 3 years.

Separate bonus points permanently for once and for all.

It's not easy though, since it's tied to the actual "main leveling point" of the jobs, this being Acranist. What you are asking for is to single out Arcanist and give them the unique capability of having 2 separate "bonus points" but it's hard to do that since when you are a SCH or a SMN, you are still leveling off Arcanist and because you are still leveling off said class, it's taking the ability points from that "class".

[Eloah]

This is for the crazy min/max players. How many people in this game actually do that. Your points are valid yes, but it doesn't change the fact that all 35 points in int on sch isn't game changing. I play smn and sch both and the points are needed more in smn than sch. The fairy scales more off gear than mind so healing isn't an issue(I've solo healed A11 normal when it first came out).

Again, keeping groups healed isn't the issue. Your fairy will normally take care of 65-90% of healing throughout the game's content anyway. Your DPS and shield potency goes down though. The 35 points is basically a piece of gear you're missing. You are right that it is not game changing, but the SCH who allocates their points correctly is going to hit harder and their shields will be more potent than the one who doesn't. I'm not even a min/max player, and I don't raid. I swap the points because it is VERY easy to do. It is inconvenient. I totally get that, which is why I don't swap every time I switch between the two jobs. Just when entering instances with other players.

You both have a valid point that the extra points offer a benefit, but the effect isn't as noticeable as you'd think. I did tests to compare the two with the points allocated in both Mind and Intelligence. Basically where the wider margin is, is where the points should be placed. In ARR, the game favored SCH so placing the points in Int for SMN was better. In HW the game favors SMN so putting the points in Mind is better. What it boiled down to was like a fraction of a percentage, it's hard to describe it... but lets say the the difference is 20pts for SMN and 40pts for SCH, SCH would need the extra boost, and vice versa. Once SB comes out, and the game receives its semi-major overhaul, I'll do the tests again. Maybe it'll stay as it is now, maybe it it'll switch back. Or maybe they will remove the stupid points since they really have no purpose but to provide pseudo-customization.

Oh and piggybacking further up this conversation, to what Gemina said about SCH having the lowest healing potency, that's actually not true. If anything they have the highest; the only difference being is it's not burst heals. I know it might look it with Lustrate and Indomitably, but it's not. Also the fairy compensates for that slightly lower mind stat, but they scale more from Det, which we only get from gear. This is the reason they had a hard time balancing AST and keeping things in check with WHM; besides the whole SCH/SMN "issue" they made SCH too "perfect" so they had to find the balance without taking away too much.

[Leigaon]

Now to the OP, are you serious, you know changes are coming but you couldn't hold your "complaining" until after Stormblood. They are adding role skills, you dont think Esuna could be a part of that. I cant say for sure though.

This is what I feel will happen, there's no need for having different Esuna spells, instead let Leeches do something different for Scholar and have Esuna become a class role.

[matteoxyz]

The only part that bothers me is the bonus point thing. I cannot understand why they have not fixed it so you can play both jobs...

[Jerbob]

Oh and don't sneak any of that, "with the split we can get a real summoner" shite, yeah, no. This, THIS, is the FFXIV SMN.

I'm not going to throw around words like "proper" and "real" because I've learned from experience that on these forums it can upset or annoy people who like XIV's SMN. That's obviously not helpful to anyone. However, I'm not going to stop asking for a Summoner job that better reflects the theme of its predecessors. If you find that irritating then I'm sorry, but a split between SCH and the current SMN would be a perfect situation to get that ball rolling. I'm not sneaking anything - it's a legitimate observation.

The fact that people keep going on about this, even after literally years of no response, should illustrate that some people are quite passionate about wanting it. I don't think "Just stop" is a good response to that. "How can we achieve this and make everyone happy?" seems like a more constructive direction.

I personally don't think a split has any downsides. Split SCH off into its own classless job starting at lv30, start ACN as a classless job at level one, and incorporate existing SMN into ACN. SCH and ACN keep the spells they currently have, but they aren't linked, so adjustments can be made. The attribute points issue disappears. SCH can get its healing tools are a more appropriate level, if this is deemed necessary. Then the work on a new SMN can begin, fans of the old one keep ACN, and everyone is happy.