Korean fan fest translation says ast changes balanced healers, do you agree?

[Kyeria]

Snip

I don't know if I agree that Balance is too strong or if it's just that raw damage bonuses are too desirable on their own. I do however agree with you on everything else, but at this point, I guess we'll have to wait and see what they do with the expansion pack. Hopefully, some changes will be brought in to satisfy everyone and make positive changes with the jobs/abilities so no one is left out.

Kind of off topic; I do have to say, I'm a little disappointed my previous post was deleted as it had nothing offensive in it as well as a few other peoples with no explanation.

[Ghishlain]

Kind of off topic; I do have to say, I'm a little disappointed my previous post was deleted as it had nothing offensive in it as well as a few other peoples with no explanation.

It most likely occurred because you quoted someone's post (or part of the offending chain) which was offensive and the mods decided to prune all the posts associated with it, unfortunately. And the post in question that was removed was certainly aggressive so don't take offense since it most likely wasn't you~

[DreamWeaver]

The AST is in a god damned mess right now, you say your identity is "muh cards", but you know what?
Your true identity is "Pray for Balance because its the only optimally useful card I have".

I at least have some fun prior to the Balance buff, as you're able to utilize any cards that you might have drawn.
Now with the insane buff to Balance, the "optimal" way to play it is to completely ignore 50% of your cards, use 33% of them for Royal Road, and pray for the 16% jackpot.

Honestly I pity AST players (myself included), the optimal way to play is the most brain dead way.

[CafPow]

To the guy talking about RNG, with the constant card changes we've had now you have something like a 36% chance to draw a Balance every 30 seconds (accounting for Shuffle). Failing that, you'll at least get a Spire or Ewer you can Royal Road, or an Arrow for a quick DPS boost on a BLM or MNK/NIN (rip their TP tho). The odds of getting a Spear>Bole Draw are the lowest they've ever been, and the meta is reflecting that. Setting up AOE Balance is no longer the unicorn it once was, and the strength of the card needs to reflect that IMO.

After (e.g.) drawing a bowl and redrawing, chances for spire / ewer are the same as for spear/arrow.....
I like the RNG factor, i wanna keep it. But it can be a bit less... sure, balance needs o be nerfed.

/edit:
i mean i'd prefer something like ...
Ewer / Spire can stay i mean, in the right Time, they are really usefull like a BRD, did sing himself OOM and you can give him Manaregg or a bombing Melee with a Spire etc. Really useful. When everithing is full, the RR-effect ist allright right?

Bole is for Tanks. Additional Mitigation is always nice, less to heal, more to DPS, nice thing, all good.

Arrow is for everyone, but DPS would recieve a Boost. To make it really really good, give him more +Speed (not much) and in addition, reduce the Mana/TP-Costs while Spear is active. That would make it always desireable without beingt completely OP like Balance is.

Spear is also for everyone, but it affects only un-used CDs. Change that, so it also lowers already used CDs, so this Card is really strong, also in Randomgrps. Having this Card 2 or 3 Times in a 10 Minute fight could lead to additional CD-uses which would probably result in higher Raid-DPS = ergo, good thing.

now... we have 2 Regenerationcards, a Tankkard, 2 Everybody-Cards which are really good DPS Cards...
so.. why not give Balance a Healing Aspect. Like, he who has Balance recieves 10% more healing? In high AoE-DMG Situation, a spreaded Balance could still be awesome.

bevor i get cruzified here, consider, Spear and Arrow would reciev a slightly buff, compensating the loss of Balance how it is, but every Card would have it's use in a certain Situation so it would be fun to play with and you woulnd't wait til Balance dropps right?

Of course one would need to look at the Numbers and do some Tuning on it but ... atm the Balance is "to much". The RNG-Factor is another Thing thou.

[loreleidiangelo]

Because "more healing" is not a utility that is needed in this game. Does no one see that? Why do you think Monks are starting to be benched now for the meta comp? Traited Mantra is actually an insanely good cooldown, except for the fact that this game has no healing requirements that make use of it.

I'm in favor of changing Balance so that it's something that doesn't boost DPS, but changing it to something that boosts healing when healers already have a bevy of cooldowns that work just fine on their own won't really make it a desirable card, it'll just get Royal Roaded for the enhanced effect and used to power up an Arrow for more DPS or a Bole so that the tank can either drop tank stance and do more DPS or so the healers can heal less and...do more DPS.

I know I tend to drag everything back to the "DPS meta" sometimes, and I'm sorry if I sound like a broken record, but it's frustrating because everything being pared down to "do your primary role as little as possible so you can DPS MOAR" is why cards are in a crap situation like this to begin with. If extra healing made fights way easier, but not required to clear? It might become more valuable. If that damage reduction helped ease mana consumption, save precious mitigation cooldowns and lower the healing load instead of giving tanks/heals more opportunities to DPS? It might become more valuable. THIS is why I'm so against the meta, because everyone's tools get watered down like this and there becomes only one real choice - the choice that better boosts group DPS. In a situation where AST cards have multiple functionalities and all those functionalities are viable because mitigation requirements and healing requirements are stricter, all the cards would start to see a lot more use, especially given certain situations. Yes, when healing or mitigation isn't readily handy, AOE Arrow would be the go-to, but it's such a marginal group DPS increase as it is that using it once or twice a fight wouldn't break any meta except at the world-first level. But you might start to see stuff like, "this hits hard, so Bole is more valuable here" or "these moves hit back-to-back so increased healing on everyone is more valuable here", or at best the efficacies would be the same so a healing up card and Bole would at worst become interchangeable in those scenarios.

Just so I don't sound like I'm only posting to preach from my soapbox, I think a change that could be done without drastically altering healing design in this game would be to have Balance operate like a mini Battle Litany instead of the flat damage boost we have now. If it has around the same efficacy as Arrow, AOEing the two would probably become a more interchangeable outcome and it would make the other cards feel a little less "dud"-ish in comparison. I've seen that suggestion bandied about here before, but can't remember what the healer community response to it was.

[CafPow]

Because "more healing" is not a utility that is needed in this game. Does no one see that? Why do you think Monks are starting to be benched now for the meta comp? Traited Mantra is actually an insanely good cooldown, except for the fact that this game has no healing requirements that make use of it.

well it has not. Yet.
One could bring on Mechanics that need more healing if one would.
Or... i mean, this was just an example how one could change something i don't know.

I'm in favor of changing Balance so that it's something that doesn't boost DPS, but changing it to something that boosts healing when healers already have a bevy of cooldowns that work just fine on their own won't really make it a desirable card, it'll just get Royal Roaded for the enhanced effect and used to power up an Arrow for more DPS or a Bole so that the tank can either drop tank stance and do more DPS or so the healers can heal less and...do more DPS.

I know I tend to drag everything back to the "DPS meta" sometimes, and I'm sorry if I sound like a broken record, but it's frustrating because everything being pared down to "do your primary role as little as possible so you can DPS MOAR" is why cards are in a crap situation like this to begin with. If extra healing made fights way easier, but not required to clear? It might become more valuable. If that damage reduction helped ease mana consumption, save precious mitigation cooldowns and lower the healing load instead of giving tanks/heals more opportunities to DPS? It might become more valuable. THIS is why I'm so against the meta, because everyone's tools get watered down like this and there becomes only one real choice - the choice that better boosts group DPS. In a situation where AST cards have multiple functionalities and all those functionalities are viable because mitigation requirements and healing requirements are stricter, all the cards would start to see a lot more use, especially given certain situations. Yes, when healing or mitigation isn't readily handy, AOE Arrow would be the go-to, but it's such a marginal group DPS increase as it is that using it once or twice a fight wouldn't break any meta except at the world-first level. But you might start to see stuff like, "this hits hard, so Bole is more valuable here" or "these moves hit back-to-back so increased healing on everyone is more valuable here", or at best the efficacies would be the same so a healing up card and Bole would at worst become interchangeable in those scenarios.

well first:
what if the actual DPS Meta changes? I mean, srsly. What "Meta" is, is also defined by the Content actually. What if there are ... like, Debuffs that reduce the Heal by 50% or whatnot and you NEED to heal more.
I enjoy doing DMG as a healer i'm not one of those "pure Healer Guys" if you'd think that but anyways it's just an idea that popped up... we could have a Card specifically for Healers... kinda...
Because we have already Cards for DPS and Tank. I mean ... srsly you also don't need any Bowl to clear content right? It's just fine without it. But still, it's a good card bc Tank can stay longer in Offstance.
So... what if we heal more with Balance? Instead of 4 Heals we just need 2, gives as 2 more GCDs to put in DMG, so, we have a DMG gain.... right?

Just so I don't sound like I'm only posting to preach from my soapbox, I think a change that could be done without drastically altering healing design in this game would be to have Balance operate like a mini Battle Litany instead of the flat damage boost we have now. If it has around the same efficacy as Arrow, AOEing the two would probably become a more interchangeable outcome and it would make the other cards feel a little less "dud"-ish in comparison. I've seen that suggestion bandied about here before, but can't remember what the healer community response to it was.

i don't quite see what effect you mean by "Battle Litany" honestly. Care to explain? :3

[Reiryuu]

i don't quite see what effect you mean by "Battle Litany" honestly. Care to explain? :3

Battle Litany is the Dragoon Party-Wide Crititcal Strike chance increase buff. The problem with WHM and healing compared to the others is while WHM can output more healing, it's entirely unnecessary since the content has to be capable of being healed without a whm, thus the utility that SCH and AST bring beyond their healing skills improves raid performance beyond what a whm is capable of at the moment.

[CafPow]

hmm yeah i see.

but increasing the crit of the Party or the DMG overall ... it's ... kinda the same... well not directly since crit / speed will empower healing, DPS and Defense (at least with Warriors ... indirectly) ... but still you'd need to tune the values of Balance. Like there's no Point in 20% Balance, i admit it's to strong though its random, and it's not fun to burn all cards until Balance dropps.

[technole]

The big deeps synergy is felt when you have DRG Battle Litany, Party-wide AST Balance, NIN Trick Attack, MCH Hypercharge, and BRD Foe all up at the same time.

Flat damage increase, with high crit chance, along boss getting damage vulnerability, along with melee and healers getting less boss damage resistance.

Welcome to the buff meta, it's not just AST balance is the issue either. The fact that MCH/BRD double ranged comp is also superior to bringing a caster. Balance is icing on the cake, and even knocking it down to Midas level it would still be superior to bringing a White Mage.

[CafPow]

Another idea

If someone gets balance, give him some kind of debuff, so he can't recieve another one for 1 or 2 minutes. That will regulate at least teh balance uptime. Bc of rng, when you are lucky you get an uptime of 90% or something.
With a change like that, balance would be okay alredy i guess.
Just fooling around here with some random ideas though.