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  1. #311
    Player
    Alleo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Posts
    4,730
    Character
    Light Khah
    World
    Moogle
    Main Class
    Arcanist Lv 91
    Normally I love discussions with people but maybe it would be better to just ignore her? I mean I read through the argument and I just cant understand how this system would benefit anyone..yet even though many people already posted counter arguments, its still a never ending story. Better to just not answer I think?
    (7)
    Letter from the Producer LIVE Part IX Q&A Summary (10/30/2013)
    Q: Will there be any maintenance fees or other costs for housing, besides the cost of the land and house?
    A: In older MMOs, such as Ultima Online, there was a house maintenance fee you had to pay weekly, but in FFXIV: ARR we decided against this system. Similarly, these older MMOs also had a system where your house would break down if you didn’t log in after a while in order to have you continue your subscription, but this is a thing of the past and we won't have any system like that.

  2. #312
    Player
    ErryK's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    2,424
    Character
    Ethan Vayne
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Sage Lv 100


    stahp
    (5)
    Last edited by ErryK; 03-06-2017 at 10:52 PM.

  3. #313
    Player
    LalaRu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    2,408
    Character
    Mi An
    World
    Phantom
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 80
    I need because I can,
    therefore I am.
    (1)

  4. #314
    Player
    Bloody's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    295
    Character
    Arkain Stormfury
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 60
    I enjoy watching the logic get twisted. I didn't ignore anything: I specifically and clearly stated what my position is, and why, and you, Cordie continue to assume superiority without even admitting your own mistakes. You can claim whatever you want about the comment below the table, but you clearly intended to draw reference between table and "fair chances" under your suggestion (see your comment: "Compare" in said quoted post).

    Also, I think you really need to learn how psychological satisfaction works, because it isn't compatible with your model, even though you quaintly added it to your list. Everyone receives some satisfaction from being rewarded for their effort, as a general rule, but the truly satisfying experiences come from being rewarded appropriately with, as the other poster put, monk gear when he runs monk.

    @Alleo, I am aware that this is a lost cause for a multitude of reasons, but it is entertaining to see how the logic is used.

    Edit: Cordie, what formula did you use for your percentiles, out of curiosity? I would like to compare.
    (2)
    Last edited by Bloody; 03-07-2017 at 01:11 AM.
    Pro DPS tactic: Big glowing orange AOE = "Stand here to boost your DPS!"
    ~Non Requiem Aeternum~

  5. #315
    Player
    Saint_Angeles's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    144
    Character
    Rana Kim
    World
    Midgardsormr
    Main Class
    Lancer Lv 70
    Hey I don't care if I'm BiS in every slot on every class I'ma roll Need if I want.

    Why? Because I want to. Deal.
    (1)

  6. #316
    Player
    ffchampion's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    220
    Character
    Vulpes Moon
    World
    Tonberry
    Main Class
    Ninja Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Soge01 View Post
    I am getting sick and tired of finding a piece of gear I need for one of my Job classes and someone with higher lvl gear who clearly doesn't need it anymore goes and hits the "Need" button anyways and snatches it away!

    Higher levels geared players should NOT have the ability to do that and needs to be changed where they have to gamble with their luck through the Greed command like everyone else who's Job class doesn't relate to a certain piece of drop gear in a dungeon.
    If you want to use a class that you are unable to need on... why don't you play as that class?! that way you can then actually press "need" yourself. in 4 man things its not very common both DPS will be the same class so you should have no problem with Needing
    (0)

  7. #317
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordie View Post
    My suggestion benefits (i) those that want gear for a class they aren’t playing to the same extent it benefits
    (ii) those who want gear for the class they are playing,
    (v) those who want gear for desynths,
    (ii) is a lie.

    those who want gear for the class they are playing has lower odds to get gear under your new system than the existing one, that's not a benefit.

    your suggestion is a detriment to group (ii) it's also a detriment to people who desynthesis because their odds decrease when they can't control what types of gear they can need on. i don't need to increase my chances to lot on weaver gear when i do desynthesis for armorer, i play tank/drg so i have better odds at those.

    you can't flatten out uneven odds for everyone and claim it's beneficial for everyone. the ones that have higher odds in the existing system are negatively impacted.
    (8)

  8. #318
    Player Kosmos992k's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Ul'Dah
    Posts
    4,349
    Character
    Kosmos Meishou
    World
    Behemoth
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 90
    After 8 pages of this bilge and still no real answer to this;

    Why shouldn't players who run the content have the same rights of rolling on drops? Those players put in effort too. Sure it's nice if everyone defers to a new player. But enforcing that as a rule seems quite unfair and will certainly reduce the number of players willing to run in DF.

    Time to cease the prattle and move on.
    (3)

  9. #319
    Player
    Cordie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    Ishgard
    Posts
    157
    Character
    Cordelia Primerain
    World
    Lich
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Bloody View Post
    I enjoy watching the logic get twisted. I didn't ignore anything: I specifically and clearly stated what my position is, and why, and you, Cordie continue to assume superiority without even admitting your own mistakes. You can claim whatever you want about the comment below the table, but you clearly intended to draw reference between table and "fair chances" under your suggestion (see your comment: "Compare" in said quoted post).
    Where's the logic getting twisted? You see a table, come up with a conclusion after doing some comparisons yourself without even taking into account what you are comparing and for which cases and then you try to attribute your results to me.
    If I "clearly intended" to draw reference between table and "fair chances" under my suggestion, then WHERE IS IT?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bloody View Post
    Also, I think you really need to learn how psychological satisfaction works, because it isn't compatible with your model, even though you quaintly added it to your list. Everyone receives some satisfaction from being rewarded for their effort, as a general rule, but the truly satisfying experiences come from being rewarded appropriately with, as the other poster put, monk gear when he runs monk.
    "Hey I picked a job! give me a trophy!". Nice!

    Quote Originally Posted by Bloody View Post
    Edit: Cordie, what formula did you use for your percentiles, out of curiosity? I would like to compare.
    the old way: get the values from one table column, find the minimum and the range (max - min). The k-th percentile is (min + (k/100) * range).

    Quote Originally Posted by SendohJin View Post
    (ii) is a lie.
    those who want gear for the class they are playing has lower odds to get gear under your new system than the existing one, that's not a benefit.
    your suggestion is a detriment to group (ii) it's also a detriment to people who desynthesis because their odds decrease when they can't control what types of gear they can need on. i don't need to increase my chances to lot on weaver gear when i do desynthesis for armorer, i play tank/drg so i have better odds at those.
    you can't flatten out uneven odds for everyone and claim it's beneficial for everyone. the ones that have higher odds in the existing system are negatively impacted.
    I didn't base my suggestion on a heavily imbalanced system like the current one, so I wouldn't seek to selectively boost the rewards for 1 or 2 cases of needing gear at the expense of all others!
    You have to choose what you want: a biased system like the one we have or a universally fair system like the one I proposed?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alleo View Post
    I mean I read through the argument and I just cant understand how this system would benefit anyone..yet even though many people already posted counter arguments, its still a never ending story.
    I guess you want a biased system, as it is now. I wouldn't be surprised if you thought your needs for gear should be placed ahead of others' too - this is becoming a theme with this approach.
    (0)

  10. #320
    Player
    Serilda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Posts
    1,885
    Character
    Renard Lefeuvre
    World
    Yojimbo
    Main Class
    Alchemist Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordie View Post
    You have to choose what you want: a biased system like the one we have or a universally fair system like the one I proposed?


    I guess you want a biased system, as it is now. I wouldn't be surprised if you thought your needs for gear should be placed ahead of others' too - this is becoming a theme with this approach.
    Sign me up for biased too. I want the needs of people who bothered playing a job I didn't want to to come before mine so I don't coast through selfishly needing on things they could actually immediately wear for my desynthesis skill ups. See, there's no actual correlation between selfishness and people happy with the current logical, practical bias other than the one you made.

    All people need to do is ask people not to Need. Last time I reply to you as you just ignore the thought that goes into everyone's arguments and spout a load of nonsense to make yourself look like an angel.
    (5)

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