The single biggest issue holding back FFXIV needs to be specifically addressed.

[Jennestia]

He's pulling crap out of his ass to try to win the debate. If he can back his theory up with evidence, I'll give it to him. But that aint gonna happen.

He does have a habit of pulling out "facts" out of nowhere when it comes to SE and their past MMOs. Neither of their previous MMOs had a serverside interface which caused a lot of the problems XIV has. XI is purely client side so above all ability timers and the like never gets screwed up unless you are having internet issues, i.e R0ing.

Besieged and Campaign had only one issue which was so much design related and not server related:

Every maintenance their status would reset and they would instantly assault the city (Besieged) or have morale reset, which was fixed.

So between 2001-2010, 3 MMOs only XIV has the problems, FFXI had technical issues in 2001 and early 2002, but almost every MMO does in their early days.

[Molly_Millions]

The fact that there is a fix in the works is enough for me to be satisfied, because honestly the fact SE will be rolling out new servers and a new client so early into the life of this game shows their dedication to making this game work like it should have on day 1. As I said, I do have experience on such a project and it's no easy task, it takes a lot of effort from a lot of people to make something like that a success.

[Noata]

Dont bring in other SE games to try to say its an SE thing. This is a built in issue on FFXIV were not talking about anything else. It is baseless to just say its been an SE problem for more then a decade. There are plenty of people who didnt have lag issues on games others do. There are many reasons why people have lag it varies from connection to proccessing toi video data. It is all about finding the bottle neck. in this particular instance there is a giant issue with the server side proccessing,. It has been addressed and will be fixed. the answer was creating zones and have a different server set up. Since it is an infrastructure issue with the game service it will take a long time to fix. Not all SE games suffer from this bottle neck, and more often then not. the bottle neck is on the user side. In this case it isnt. if you personally had lag issue over all other SE online games. the problem is likely you. not SE. as many have not had this issue

[Betelgeuzah]

This has been an issue for SE from 2002-present day. It never got fixed in ffxi or in the multiple years of FFXIV development or during the first 13 months of retail. I would say as pressing an issue as it is you would think it would have been fixed already BUT as with every single other negative this will be 100% fixed in the golden patch of 2.0.

Server issues get fixed when server solutions are implemented. How can you make this seem like rocket science? The servers are being redesigned specifically to fix all these problems and to provide more efficient gameplay environment. They're not coming just for the sake of having new servers.

If they decided to try to patch the current DoA servers, yes, we might have a fix on our hands. as well as crappy, unflexible servers that require significant tweaks to make even the basic functions possible to be implemented. You either go all the way and implement new servers or try to cope with what's there.

You seem to be a fan of the latter, but I can't say I agree.

What I am actually saying is this is a huge issue and has been for almost a decade why are they JUST NOW starting to work on it?

The community has never perceived it as a "huge issue" in XI. Much like with the UI that isn't really optimal for proper mouse/keyboard gameplay, the community adapted and got used to it. Not to mention the slower paced gameplay made it seem like a less of a deal as well.

It only became a pressing matter now that they attempted to create "faster" gameplay with the same crappy servers. It was never seen as a huge issue in XI.

[TonyMontana]

Ok, I play with 2 accounts and 2 computers in every MMO I have ever played(One for me one for my wife). The issue of your character displaying in 1 spot on one computer but when you look at the other computer the character is in a different spot WAS in FFXI atleast as of late 2004 when i quit. Of the 5 MMOs I have played since none (other than FFXIV) have had this issue NEARLY to the extent the 2 SE MMOs I have played have.

Maybe it wasnt an issue that bothered you guys in FFXI but it still existed.

So if you feel it wasnt a major issue until FFXIV then fine lets roll with that. So if you guys want to view this as an FFXIV exclusive issue then its been a major issue for somewhere between 3 and 6 years.

Let that sink in. SE this huge corporation, gaming GIANT has had this major problem for the last 3-6 years AND not only is it not fixed we can only HOPE it will be fixed a year from now.

The ball has been dropped, not only dropped but abandoned for 3-6 years +1 +maybe more if they they dont get it right for 2.0s release.

I am happy for you guys who have tons of faith in SE. I think Yoshi has made some strides in the right direction so I think its possible he will fix what needs to be fixed. However Yoshi's addition of auto attack made combat completely boring and unfun for me so forgive me if I dont have 100% blind faith in him.

[Answa]

This doesn't affect gameplay at all. I say concentrate on things that matter.

[Jennestia]

Ok, I play with 2 accounts and 2 computers in every MMO I have ever played(One for me one for my wife). The issue of your character displaying in 1 spot on one computer but when you look at the other computer the character is in a different spot

You do realize, this is very common even outside of MMOs right? This has to do with packets, not the game, because I play FFXI with my sister and brother, and I'm standing side by side with my brother at the same time. When our internet is having issues he would "jump forward" quite a bit when I think he's lagging behind me, that's not SE's problem, that's a problem with my internet.

Packet loss, not game design, not server issues. FFXIV however is purposefully designed to display as such. FMO nor FFXI was designed to do as such. I've seen this happen in WoW, I've seen it happen in Rift (sliding), I've seen it happen in Ragnarok (Phasing), I've seen it happen in Everquest ('sprinting') and only when it's being played in the same house, I've never seen it happen when I'm playing with others however.

However with FFXIV, it happens with others as well as those in the same house, so yes, this designed into FFXIV which I believe they even said it was designed in such a way -- I mean, when you get knocked back in FFXI you don't scale entire mountains, your character gets pushed back (physically displays it) and gets stuck onto the wall.

The difference? To others sometimes it looks like you've turned around and started to walk.

[Molly_Millions]

Ok, I play with 2 accounts and 2 computers in every MMO I have ever played(One for me one for my wife). The issue of your character displaying in 1 spot on one computer but when you look at the other computer the character is in a different spot WAS in FFXI atleast as of late 2004 when i quit. Of the 5 MMOs I have played since none (other than FFXIV) have had this issue NEARLY to the extent the 2 SE MMOs I have played have.

Maybe it wasnt an issue that bothered you guys in FFXI but it still existed.

So if you feel it wasnt a major issue until FFXIV then fine lets roll with that. So if you guys want to view this as an FFXIV exclusive issue then its been a major issue for somewhere between 3 and 6 years.

Let that sink in. SE this huge corporation, gaming GIANT has had this major problem for the last 3-6 years AND not only is it not fixed we can only HOPE it will be fixed a year from now.

The ball has been dropped, not only dropped but abandoned for 3-6 years +1 +maybe more if they they dont get it right for 2.0s release.

I am happy for you guys who have tons of faith in SE. I think Yoshi has made some strides in the right direction so I think its possible he will fix what needs to be fixed. However Yoshi's addition of auto attack made combat completely boring and unfun for me so forgive me if I dont have 100% blind faith in him.

Your argument doesn't hold weight. Even if FFXI has these issues, it's a different game and likely has a different cause. Like I said, if you want to win that argument you're gonna have to back it up with facts not speculation. I told you what you need to prove your case. Get to it, provide us with some proof.

[TonyMontana]

You do realize, this is very common even outside of MMOs right? This has to do with packets, not the game, because I play FFXI with my sister and brother, and I'm standing side by side with my brother at the same time. When our internet is having issues he would "jump forward" quite a bit when I think he's lagging behind me, that's not SE's problem, that's a problem with my internet.

Packet loss, not game design, not server issues. FFXIV however is purposefully designed to display as such. FMO nor FFXI was designed to do as such. I've seen this happen in WoW, I've seen it happen in Rift (sliding), I've seen it happen in Ragnarok (Phasing), I've seen it happen in Everquest ('sprinting') and only when it's being played in the same house, I've never seen it happen when I'm playing with others however.

However with FFXIV, it happens with others as well as those in the same house, so yes, this designed into FFXIV which I believe they even said it was designed in such a way -- I mean, when you get knocked back in FFXI you don't scale entire mountains, your character gets pushed back (physically displays it) and gets stuck onto the wall.

The difference? To others sometimes it looks like you've turned around and started to walk.

When I am standing in fire in wow on my screen I am taking damage when i am not standing in fire on my screen on wow I am not taking damage, I understand what you are referring to about internet connection but it is more than that for FFXIV.

Its amazing internal testers didnt catch it but then again look at what was released to us last Sept I guess they didnt catch a lot of things.

[TonyMontana]

Your argument doesn't hold weight. Even if FFXI has these issues, it's a different game and likely has a different cause. Like I said, if you want to win that argument you're gonna have to back it up with facts not speculation. I told you what you need to prove your case. Get to it, provide us with some proof.

I told you forget FFXI. Look at FFXIV only. Watch the video there is your proof it exists. It existed before the game hit retail and it still exists today. What proof are you looking for?

Oh and as far as "winning" this argument I know thats not going to happen. I am not going to change your mind and you arent going to change mine. No one is going to "win" anything here.