Request/Idea: Capture The Flag(Frontline: PvP)

[Magic-Mal]

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I don't really like Seal Rock's King Of The Hill because again, they added these extra mechanics to make it not really King Of The Hill..

Bases are done completely with RNG which can make it very unfair. One time a triple S rank spawned in the caves where Flames based. We lost of course. Or a in a close 750/800 to 750/800 game, all a team needs is to have a node spawn close to them by luck and they win. Happened so many times. I hate that.

DC Universe Online(not sure if anything has changed) did their PvP KotH matches really well. If an opposing member was on the base it was contested until they were gone. And stuff didn't spawn in favor of another team. Such as lucky spawns or lucky S ranks..

We may see CTF or some other 2 team modes in 4.0. Currently it wouldnt work but since the new modes in 4.0 were the reason of the gc restriction its highly possible.

1). Why does it not work with 3 teams?
2). What new 4.0 modes? :0

[Februs]

1). Why does it not work with 3 teams?

Because it's not viable with 3 teams.

A proper CTF game mode has one objective (ie: the flag). In a 2 team match, it basically works out that one team has the flag, while the other defends it until they can score. The status quo is always the same regardless of who has the flag. If there are 3 teams, however, than whoever has the objective is subject to a 2 v 1 gank. Assuming all 3 teams are equally invested in winning, then scoring would be nearly impossible. The only way it would work out would be if one team is pants-on-head stupid or, vice versa, leagues better than the other 2. This kind of team dynamic would also open the door to easier match fixing, as it would be possible for two full teams to team up against the 3rd. One team would throw the match, while their partner cinched the win.

2). What new 4.0 modes? :0

They haven't announced them yet; however, when they announced the removal of GC restrictions, they heavily implied that the upcoming 4.0 game modes were the reason behind their decision. To most of us, this implies 2-team game modes. The fact that we will still be able to queue up as a specific GC member also implies this, because it would seem that whatever they have planned has no GC v GC lore involved.

To be fair, it could mean a lot of things. They could be overhauling the GC system entirely, for all we know. They could also be simplifying the queue process for the sake of old or outdated rewards that are nearly impossible to achieve with the current GC match-ups. They could be considering a PvPvE MOBA styled game mode. Or, it could just be a simple matter of changing the current lore. They did announce that OMEGA WEAPON would be the next major raid. That particular bit of lore was first mentioned as the reason behind the GC Frontline conflicts in the first place, so if the lore of the main title is taking us back to that plot point, then they could be making the necessary PvP adjustments to suit the new direction of the story. Yoshi-P also hinted that they are considering some variety of open-world PvP later in the Stormblood life-cycle, as well more attention to PvP on the whole (I'll believe that when I see it). In any case, there's a lot in the air right now. We'll need to wait and see what happens when the dust settles.

[Magic-Mal]

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I see.. I can understand that way of thinking with factions teaming up on one for the flag. However in FFXIV it can be pretty hard to kill people lol.. Depending on how good your healers are. Sadly, I've already experienced getting KO'ed by one faction and then watching the other get KO'ed. Considering the fact that the flag would be planted down however, I think after the defending team falls, the other 2 factions will have to fight just to get the flag off xD.

With GC restrictions gone, wouldn't it be alot harder to do win-trading?? Unlike now?

[Februs]

Considering the fact that the flag would be planted down however, I think after the defending team falls, the other 2 factions will have to fight just to get the flag off xD.

We've already seen a similar system in both Secure and Seize. It's very rare for all three teams to balance out. More often than not it turns into a 2v1 gank, or one team simply gets ignored while the other two duke it out. Secure was the closest to getting it right back when it was still 72 man because there was an even distribution of outlying camps, but even that could easily turn into a mess if one GC started allying themselves with another.

Bursting targets is also a non-issue. Limit breaks make short work of health bars, and focusing all the action into one spot, fixed or otherwise, guarantees a gank. There is no degree of healing that can beat the pure number supremacy of a 2v1 gank, unless the 2 are playing with only auto attacks or something equally stupid. Party compositions are also random and unrestricted in Frontlines, which makes it an uneven roll of the dice as to who will have the biggest gun or the largest sustain. SE could get around that by implementing forced party compositions (2 tank/2 heals/4 dps), but they'd be harming queues in the process and removing one of the biggest draw factors to the game mode.

[Februs]

With GC restrictions gone, wouldn't it be alot harder to do win-trading?? Unlike now?

It would actually be easier without GC affiliations ... in theory.

Currently, to fix a match you first have to organize two parties from two different GC's, which means you need a somewhat even split of GC affiliates. Second, you need to fill the exact amount of players to actually get a queue to go through. Full Pre-mades are often a no-go, because the number random queued solo-players can generate a dead queue line. The game has conniption fits when it tries to fill a full match with uneven sets of players. Third, the two independent parties from two different GC's need to get into the same match for them to fix it. It's possible to organize that kind of thing with 3rd party chat, such as discord, but it is still a headache, and you can only skip 3 queues before it's a ban. This doesn't seem like much; however, one, rather massive, drawback to match-fixers is that not all of the three GC's queue equally. Mael has astronomically long queues, whereas Adders are relatively short. This means that it may actually be impossible for your two pre-made parties to get into the same match, depending on how many people are queuing for each GC at that time. The fact that queues are naturally long due to GC restrictions just makes this issue worse. Finally, if you manage all of the above and get into a match, you still have to deal with the logistics of random players. In a full 72 man game, you have 2 other alliances that can throw a wrench into your match fixing efforts. In an incomplete 8-man party, any randoms you have can also make a difference. It's still possible, of course, and one full team of sleeper agents can do a lot of damage, but it is not necessarily easy or effective.

Now, take out GC requirements. The first, and biggest, hurdle to match fixing is completely removed, because anyone can join in your pre-made parties. The queue will also be standardized across all players. There won't be any more discrepancies between Mael / Adder / Flame queues, because you are not required to queue up as any of the 3. That means a far faster queue rate on a "first come, first served" basis. In theory, 2 pre-made parties queuing up at the same time will be FAR more likely to meet each other in the same match under those conditions, because they queued at the same time and neither group are shackled by their traditional GC restriction (ie: Mael has to wait an eternity, whereas Adders can just go right in). The only thing that would be left to throw a wrench into the works is the random players, but how much or little they get in the way will depend on how many solo-players are queuing up at any given time. Peak times vs dead times can still be worked around.

In the end, the only way to stop match fixing completely would be to simply do away with 3-way matches, depending on the game mode. It can be worked into certain things just fine, and there is some fun to be had in that uneven styled game play, but in something like CTF it would only make a mess of what could be a fun and competitive game.

[Magic-Mal]

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Ty for your posts Februs ^-^. They were very informative and I understand the queue stuff alot better now!

[Februs]

Ty for your posts Februs ^-^. They were very informative and I understand the queue stuff alot better now!

Anytime! That's what the forums are here for. Glad I could help ... sorry for being wordy, though. I'm bad for that >.>