Regarding Full Party Premades in Frontline and Patch 3.5

[Murph]

You can beat premades, it's harder but completely possible.

The problem is nobody leads on Adders anymore. Back in the day myself, Sneak Ers, and many others used to try and lead the GC. The problem is that we got tired of the people that wouldn't listen, premade or not, you can't win when half your team is just screwing around, it's frustrating, so most left to other games or played Feast.

If you want to beat them, create an LS of your own, recruit good players and teach them how to play.

I've been playing FL again lately, but I didn't for quite a few months. However if you go back to the secure/slaughter days, Adders were dominant on Primal, it comes and goes. Mael has really been the only dominant GC for MOST of FL existence, but they are all just band-wagoners anyway

[Guesswhat]

You can beat premades, it's harder but completely possible.

The smartest thing is to flank the premades. Not necessarily for victory, but if you want to kill them it is, which is often needed to beat them. The problem is timing. With a pug team you tell them in advance "we must flank them blahblahblahexplanationexplanation ... get ready". Then, when you see the perfect opportunity, you spam "<se.1>GOGOG!". But, of course, half team+ waits too long and opportunity lost. For me, unwillingness to actual pvp from pug team has cost us many victories.

[KusoWat]

Not for this at all.

Playing with random players is not what an MMORPG is about for me, it's about playing with friends. If I can't choose who to queue up with, then I don't want to queue up.

[Evilsyndicatemember]

You can beat premades, it's hard but completely possible. If you go back to the 50 FL days, Adders were dominant on Primal, it comes and goes. Mael has really been the only dominant GC for MOST of FL existence.

Thanks Khonor.

Not sure if they're dropping GC reqs for this patch but if they do and do cross-DC qs then there'll be a variety of groups across. It would no longer just be strong GCs but premades we'd have to watch for. I hate playing against premades but fighting them is fun if you have a good team. All DCs have premades for us on Primal there's Mael Excal, (Currently) Mael Levi, Flames Lamia, etc. But with the upcoming patch everyone is prepping with their servers to create premades.

My server has pvpers but the problem with us is that no one wants to switch GCs or because of rivalry won't switch to a certain GC (Mine is Adders, I'm Rank 50 in Flames and Mael). Hopefully with qs popping and more premades playing it will generate the excitement and population we had during SR when we had 72-mans galore. Plus it'd be fun to see old pvpers coming out of the woodworks and new players alike.

Here's to PvP. May the odds be ever in your favour.

[Synestra]

As a full-time solo quer since secure i must say FL would be extremely boring without premades as bunch of solo players simply doesnt offer the challenge compared to when you are against premades, only time its sucks to go against premades is when 2 PuG GC's doesnt know how to teamup and f..kup those premades.

[Dimitrii]

Mael has really been the only dominant GC for MOST of FL existence, but they are all just band-wagoners anyway

I don't know about dominant but they have at least been competent and competitive during each frontline mode iteration (although I have no idea how they are now since I quit frontlines after I got the shatter mount months ago since that mode is garbage as did alot of the better Mael players I would assume). Adders usually were pretty good and seen as the main competition as a Mael with Flames only capable of being competitive when they had premades running, otherwise they could be ignored and you would just hope they would non sensically hound the other team all match instead of your own. The bit about most of Mael being bandwagon jumpers is right on the money too. Our queues were always terrible because of that.

[Chevronone]

Anybody who thinks allowing full premades is fair in a solo queue environment either 1.) Has a premade or 2.) Has no clue about Frontlines.


This is why Feast has a separate mode for Solo and premade light party. There is an inherent advantage of one over the other.

[loreleidiangelo]

Anybody who thinks allowing full premades is fair in a solo queue environment either 1.) Has a premade or 2.) Has no clue about Frontlines.


This is why Feast has a separate mode for Solo and premade light party. There is an inherent advantage of one over the other.

I concur with this. I was once the leader of a hugely preeminent Primal Adders premade during the Slaughter days, and unless both GCs double-dogged us there was no competition. Literally, the best matches of that time we had were against a Primal Flames premade organized by the now-defunct FC Advent Union, where half the time we'd both throw the match to Mael simply because we were too focused on duking it out over our mutual rivalry then actually completing objectives.

The only issue I have with trying to completely debunk premades is that I actually like queuing with a few FC mates to do matches. Usually not a full premade, but how would you devise a queue for players who want to roll 4/8?

[SuperZay]

I think many premades actually enjoy steamrolling noobs/tome farmers in a sadistic way. Especially if you turn off music and hear all these dying screams (au ra males and lalas especially). That's, like, very funny.

[Zojha]

[...] but how would you devise a queue for players who want to roll 4/8?

In theory it's simple: If you have premades, you go on an iterative journey to find penalties/handicaps for teams with premades of various sizes that work out to a winrate equal to that of non-premades on average. They have an advantage and you cancel out that advantage (on average).

That's something League of Legends is currently trying with its dynamic queue. It's a long and difficult process and we don't even have a proper MMR, hidden or not. I don't think that's a realistic option for this game. And demanding a premade queue of equal size on the other teams would make queue times killer. One can also try to say:"Okay, up to 2 people is okay in 8vs8vs8, so you can go up to 6 in 24vs24vs24". But again, waiting for a 72 to pop...

It's one of the many things that just don't have a good solution with the given size of the playerbase. You can only pick the lesser evil.