Dillemma, and legit question of ethics.

[Awful]

I dunno why you bother posting on here when it's a matter that can get them perma-banned it's kind of embarrassing posting allover the forums and if they frequent them it's basically public shaming them without actually mentioning their name. It is wrong but I think you guy should of taken a more private approach to this just my 2 cents on it.

[Kinkoz]

If I suspect a close friend is botting, I'll ask them about it in private just to satisfy curiosity and turn a blind eye from there. No need for all this dramatic bullcrap or preachy, holier-than-thou nonsense. If they happen to get in trouble for it, then, hey, that's on them. A cautionary warning is fine and all if you want your friend to be sure that they know what they're getting themselves into, but I'm not about to go selling out a buddy.

It's not my place to act as a moral authority for other people. A few of the replies I've seen in this thread are some seriously petty, self-righteous, ego stroking though.

[Culfinrandir]

I'd confront them & act depending on the botting behaviour. If it's something that affects other players, like gathering to sell or botting content then I would report if I had proof.

[Culfinrandir]

On the contrary, there are breaking of laws. SE's laws. The ToS. You can get your account suspended (the "you" here is in general, not "you" you.) :P
To some people, their character is infinitely valuable. Might be "just a game" to you, but it's "more than a game" to some others.

The ToS are actually a legally binding agreement between you & SE. Most people don't realise that. If they wanted to SE could actually take legal action if you broke them. I doubt they ever would but other companies have done so for persistent or gross breaches.

[Lyraele]

The ToS are actually a legally binding agreement between you & SE. Most people don't realise that. If they wanted to SE could actually take legal action if you broke them. I doubt they ever would but other companies have done so for persistent or gross breaches.

Errrr. No. They could take away your account, that's about it. At least in the US. But I doubt other regions of the world allow anything more than that, either. If you are thinking of things like the WoWglider case, that wasn't a ToS violation that allowed Blizzard to win, it was the whole reverse-engineering-runs-afoul-of-the-DMCA thing.

And as far as the topic goes, I wouldn't say anything in-game or on S-E's forums or whatever, I'd contact the person out-of-band (Discord, probably) to give them a "you should knock that off" message and then blithely ignore it altogether. Because a real-life friendship is more important than some game's ToS. If it's not an RL friend, I'll just report them.

[Roth_Trailfinder]

The ToS are actually a legally binding agreement between you & SE. Most people don't realise that. If they wanted to SE could actually take legal action if you broke them. I doubt they ever would but other companies have done so for persistent or gross breaches.

I'd have to double check, but isn't RMT against the TOS? Assuming that it is, how come we have never heard of SE suing those websites that persist in advertising their existence in game?

The problem is, TOS are binding, but they are not as binding as some would hope. I for one would love to see those RMT spammers put out of business so hard that their descendants are still reeling from the financial ruin twenty years later.

But, that's a digression. Regarding the TC's concern, I play Everquest, as well as FF14. I used to be in a raiding guild there, that had a strict no cheating policy. This actually kind of bit us on the butt, because we had one app come to us, and not knowing any better, we let him in. A few months later, he was even posting screenshots on the guild's webpage. After one particular webpage update, I got a tell from someone on another server (tells to people on other servers are a thing in EQ) asking if my guild allowed or encouraged cheating. I told him that we do not, and asked why he was asking. Turns out the screenshots this app had posted were taken while using a cheating program, and had several obvious clues if you knew what to look for. Since none of us knew, we did not realize it when he posted them. After that cross server tell the officers investigated and he was officially removed from the guild. I have no idea if SoE was made aware of this person's use of that software (that software was punishable by banning, just as I'd imagine botting software here in FF14 would be) but, that app went away and I never heard from him again. I do not know if the banhammer came down upon him, or if he moved servers, or what.

However much it may hurt to lose a friendship, if you can confirm that the person is using "illegal" software, you should report that person. If you cannot, then keep your mouth shut and your eyes open. In the end, we are all agreeing to play this game without cheating, by agreeing to the TOS. Someone who is cheating, is not being honest or fair with you, however much you may enjoy their friendship. Ultimately, it is better to forge new friendships, with people that share your values, than to keep one friendship with someone who obviously does not.

Put another way ... TC, you say that the person suspected is close to you. Just how close are YOU to HIM/HER, if they are cheating and you don't KNOW about it, but merely suspect it? Your friendship may not be as close as you would like to think. It may, but it may not be.

[Meeka19]

It depends on the type of botting. If it's a lvling bot like a fate farmer I don't care. Only time I care is regarding rmt, because that hurts everyone else, as it devalues their currency and their buying power if someone buys gil. I am 100% skeptic anyone who'd do this cares how it affects everyone else, so I already know talking with them will change nothing. If it were an rmt bot however I'd have no idea who it belongs to so......
If it's a gathering bot (not sure if those exist) it depends on whether it's on a massive scale. (setting it up to work very long hours and even nights a normal player can't do while sleeping)
I probably wouldn't report aside from rmt, and I wouldn't report my close friends.

[Kinkoz]

Put another way ... TC, you say that the person suspected is close to you. Just how close are YOU to HIM/HER, if they are cheating and you don't KNOW about it, but merely suspect it? Your friendship may not be as close as you would like to think. It may, but it may not be.

That's silly, excessive, and a bit invasive. Knowing every single detail of another person's dealings and activities isn't the sign of a close friendship. That's borderline obsession, which isn't healthy.

[Roth_Trailfinder]

That's silly, excessive, and a bit invasive. Knowing every single detail of another person's dealings and activities isn't the sign of a close friendship. That's borderline obsession, which isn't healthy.

Yes and no. I'm not saying to "know every single detail" - I'm merely saying that friends talk to one another. The closer the friendship, the more friends fill each other in on just stuff. If there's something relatively important, friends generally want their friends to know. And if its unimportant, its even more likely to be mentioned in passing, as a filler detail for whatever was under discussion, eventually.

And if that chatter is not two-way, or is generally more one way than the other, something may not be right.

[Blackcanary]

What is Botting?