[DEV REQUEST] Please make the Hellhound Obtainable By More than Just the Top 100 PVP

[Velhart]

As usual people feel entitled to something.

There should be things that only top 100 can get. Rather it be gear, mount, or minion. Sorry, but you can't have everything you want in this game unless you put the effort towards it. I don't PvP, I don't feel entitled to the mount at all.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

As usual people feel entitled to something.

There should be things that only top 100 can get. Rather it be gear, mount, or minion. Sorry, but you can't have everything you want in this game unless you put the effort towards it. I don't PvP, I don't feel entitled to the mount at all.

You're glossing over the actual complaint. People could put in the effort, yet still fall short on the basis you're actually encouraged to stop queuing for PvP once you rank high enough because there is no rank depreciation. Furthermore, exclusivity is a terrible way of incentivizing people into PvP. Like it or not, FFXIV needs to incentivize more people as PvP is basically on life support at the moment. You aren't going to do that by rewarding only the top 100 players on the whole datacenter. Call it selfish all you fancy, but they just won't do it. Look no further than Alexander. Gordias practically destroyed the raid community and Midas only made things worse. The creator, meanwhile, incentivized people to try because it was far more lenient, and thus, inviting. Right now, PvP has a high barrier for entry and nothing to encourage people who aren't naturally inclined to PvP.

[Aviars]

Irrelevant, as there's gonna be rank 100 PvPers who will do same.

It actually is relevant. If you know most people who whine won't use it anyway then what's the point? You then see they whine because it hurts their fee fees about not being good enough.

Newsflash: There's been suggestions that'd still keep the amount of effort intact, without making the mount a joke to obtain. There are ways to make it obtainable outside being in the rank 100, without everyone having it.

In fact, if you look at the top 10 rarest mounts, it has the Aerodynamics System at #2 (100 wins in the Fields of Glory), the Gloria-class Airship at #4 (200 wins in The Feast), the Serpent Warsteed at #5, Storm Warsteed at #8, Flame Warsteed at #9 (100 Frontline wins in their respective Grand Companies), with the Logistics System (original ADS mount, 200 Frontline wins) only barely falling outside the top 10 (rank #11), but it'll likely regain its spot once A12S can be overgeared.

That's almost all the PvP mounts in the top 10, and none of them are time exclusive. You'll probably just ignore this though, since everyone obviously has those mounts!

That actually brings up a interesting point. If these whiners still don't care enough to get the mount when it is that easy to get then why are they whining? Oh ya, there's the idea that you actually have to have skill in order to get it. It is one thing for a person to get a certain number of wins, it is completely another to actually be THE BEST at a certain game mode. Biggest reason why people are so triggered. It hurts the fees really hard.

And you say they aren't time exclusive, I beg to differ, even the worst players will win a game. Even a player with a 1% win rate can eventually get those mounts. So you are just flat out wrong.

I understand that mentioning WoW is like mentioning the plague, but I'll use it as an example anyway. The most recent WoW expansion moved away from the unarmored/armored mounts for PvE/PvP (respectively), and there were a lot of complaints about it. They changed it back to unarmored/armored mounts and both sides were happy about it.

You didn't seem to read my post where I said people were actually complaining about the minion being both party and solo ranked Feast. THEY COMPLAIN ABOUT HAVING TO DO BOTH due to the shear fact that the minions WILL BE DIFFERENT. You certainly can't be a completionist for minions or mounts if they are different correct? You are literally just pointing out the culture difference between WoW players and ffxiv players. WoW players actually respect skill. So far FFXIV players seem to be allergic to the idea of giving special things to skilled players.

[Praesul]

Who said the rewards are incentive to get people to pvp? If they wanted to incentivize people in the first place they never would have made the rewards exclusive. They already had grindy pvp achievements and gear that people could have gotten before, it's not like they were confused as to how to do it.

The fact is, they made it exclusive on purpose. It's SUPPOSED to be prestigious, it's supposed to be a hard earned reward. The goal isn't to get more people to play, the goal is to reward the people who put in the time and effort. Otherwise they would have added another ADS/Gloria ship achievement for people to farm and earn regardless of winrate.

[Aviars]

You're glossing over the actual complaint. People could put in the effort, yet still fall short on the basis you're actually encouraged to stop queuing for PvP once you rank high enough because there is no rank depreciation.

Yes you fall short by not playing anymore and therefore not trying. Maybe you should reword this so it doesn't contradict itself in the same sentence c;

Furthermore, exclusivity is a terrible way of incentivizing people into PvP. Like it or not, FFXIV needs to incentivize more people as PvP is basically on life support at the moment. You aren't going to do that by rewarding only the top 100 players on the whole datacenter.

I'm not gonna lie I think normal tier rewards are pretty bad and should be improved. But arguing that top 100 shouldn't get anything special is just downright sad and makes you look bitter.

Call it selfish all you fancy, but they just won't do it. Look no further than Alexander. Gordias practically destroyed the raid community and Midas only made things worse. The creator, meanwhile, incentivized people to try because it was far more lenient, and thus, inviting. Right now, PvP has a high barrier for entry and nothing to encourage people who aren't naturally inclined to PvP.

Ok, if they won't do it they won't get it right? That is pretty much how any game works. Saying that 'they just won't do it' doesn't mean anything haha. What a dumb thing to say.

[Velhart]

You're glossing over the actual complaint. People could put in the effort, yet still fall short on the basis you're actually encouraged to stop queuing for PvP once you rank high enough because there is no rank depreciation. Furthermore, exclusivity is a terrible way of incentivizing people into PvP. Like it or not, FFXIV needs to incentivize more people as PvP is basically on life support at the moment. You aren't going to do that by rewarding only the top 100 players on the whole datacenter. Call it selfish all you fancy, but they just won't do it. Look no further than Alexander. Gordias practically destroyed the raid community and Midas only made things worse. The creator, meanwhile, incentivized people to try because it was far more lenient, and thus, inviting. Right now, PvP has a high barrier for entry and nothing to encourage people who aren't naturally inclined to PvP.

If it something that could actually give you an advantage over someone in the game you could have a point. It is only a mount however. It is glamour. Something fancy to stare at. It doesn't make harder content all the sudden easy. Maybe of saying you want the same exact mount that PvP'ers earned, maybe you should ask for a similar mount like how there is the 1.0 Goobue and the Sylph quest Goobue. Clearly distinguishable between the two.

Also, there isn't much you can do regards PvP. If you don't go in the mindset that you are fighting another player and not an NPC, then be prepared to be disappointed. Its easy enough to make PvE content easier. PvP you are left to your own abilities. SE can adjust rules but you are still left up to whoever you fight against. If you put the effort to be the top 100, you deserve that mount. If you can't get it due you not putting the effort or lack the skill the get to the top, then well, sorry.

Don't know why I say this anyways. SE always caves and gives the entitled snowflakes what they want anyways. If I see someone wearing the fancy PvP coat or riding that mount, all I will think to myself is that he did a good job and deserves to be wearing it around. I don't PvP so I feel no sense of entitlement to get my own. Like I said, doesn't matter, complain enough and they will give you one. Sad truth.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Yes you fall short by not playing anymore and therefore not trying. Maybe you should reword this so it doesn't contradict itself in the same sentence c;

That isn't a contradiction. People already ranked have literally no incentivize to keep playing if they want the Hellhound. This influences queues, thus making it incredibly difficult just to play enough matches. There's a reason virtually every competitive PvP game has some form of rank depreciation. It prevents people from sitting on their title after the first week.

I'm not gonna lie I think normal tier rewards are pretty bad and should be improved. But arguing that top 100 shouldn't get anything special is just downright sad and makes you look bitter.

It's called having a differing opinion. If I cared enough about the Hellhound, I would be playing PvP. Overwatch lacks any exclusive rewards besides promotional stuff and it's currently among the most popular PvP games in the world.

Ok, if they won't do it they won't get it right? That is pretty much how any game works. Saying that 'they just won't do it' doesn't mean anything haha. What a dumb thing to say.

Only when you strip the context and don't actually read what I wrote. The whole point of this reward is to incentivize PvP. If it fails to accomplish that objective, then the devs have to come up with a better alternative. If the devs only wanted to reward current PvPers, they wouldn't be constantly trying new ways to entice people to PvP. They aren't because there isn't any incentivize for them.

sigh

See above.

You missed the point entirely. The devs are attempting to incentivize people who aren't inclined to PvP to give it a whirl. You do not accomplish this with exclusive content. It will not work, hence why games like Overwatch or virtually any FPS make the rewards difficult to obtain but always obtainable. Call it entitlement all you fancy, if the end result is dead content, you've essentially wasted your time developing it. Right now PvP in FFXIV is on life support. No one does it save the initial few weeks of a new map release. If the intent is to change that, you have to address why people aren't interested.

Bringing up Legacy rewards is little more than a strawman. They aren't designed to incentivize content. Mounts and minions in PvP are put there in the hopes more people will participate.

[Nezerius]

It actually is relevant. If you know most people who whine won't use it anyway then what's the point? You then see they whine because it hurts their fee fees about not being good enough.

It's irrelevant because there's both whining players and players who earned the mount who will barely use it, and go back to their default most-used mount.

That actually brings up a interesting point. If these whiners still don't care enough to get the mount when it is that easy to get then why are they whining? Oh ya, there's the idea that you actually have to have skill in order to get it. It is one thing for a person to get a certain number of wins, it is completely another to actually be THE BEST at a certain game mode. Biggest reason why people are so triggered. It hurts the fees really hard.

Yea man, totally has to do with those unskilled plebs who can't get wins, not because of the 30-60 min queue times. The GC change in 3.5 will probably add more to PvP participation than the Hellhound ever will.

And you say they aren't time exclusive, I beg to differ, even the worst players will win a game. Even a player with a 1% win rate can eventually get those mounts. So you are just flat out wrong.

Re-read my post, I said the mounts I listed weren't time exclusive, which is correct. 3 years from now, I'll still be able to get the original ADS mount (if I manage to get into enough winning frontlines games). On the other hand, the Hellhound will only be around for two seasons (hence, time exclusive).

WoW players actually respect skill. So far FFXIV players seem to be allergic to the idea of giving special things to skilled players.

Lmao, you clearly never played WoW.

I'll throw in another easy suggestion anyway. Reaching gold rating at the end of a PvP season could reward a token, that can be turned in for a mount of the player's choosing (future proof, since there's only 1 mount now, there'll likely be more later on). Rating decay happens every week, making it so players have to keep their rating up throughout the season. Incentive for players to be skilled without it being tied to a top 100. Will probably lower the PvP queues too, so more PvP matches for you to do.

[Velhart]

See above.

You missed the point entirely. The devs are attempting to incentivize people who aren't inclined to PvP to give it a whirl. You do not accomplish this with exclusive content. It will not work, hence why games like Overwatch or virtually any FPS make the rewards difficult to obtain but always obtainable. Call it entitlement all you fancy, if the end result is dead content, you've essentially wasted your time developing it. Right now PvP in FFXIV is on life support. No one does it save the initial few weeks of a new map release. If the intent is to change that, you have to address why people aren't interested.

Bringing up Legacy rewards is little more than a strawman. They aren't designed to incentivize content. Mounts and minions in PvP are put there in the hopes more people will participate.

I didn't miss the point. You just won't accept my answer to it. The Cerberus in concept is not to give incentive to people who may be interested in PvP. It is for the dedicated PvP player who likes a trophy as a representation like how athletes like trophies to represent their winning of a game. This was not made for PvE players. This was not made for casual PvP players. This is for the best of the best of the people who put a strong emphasis on PvP and put a lot of time into being the top at it. The coat and Cerberus are their trophies. They earned it, they have the right to show it off. It is their clear representation of their achievement.

Legacy rewards isn't a strawman argument. Lets be honest here, the argument truly is here that people want this Cerberus mount without having to be top 100 PvP or even really PvP in general if we want to stretch this a bit further. If they added a normal Cerberus mount you could get via PvE and then a Cerberus mount that had a collar that said "PvP" on it from being top 100, no one would care about the PvP mount. This topic would not of even been made. People complained that only 1.0 players got to have a goobue mount. They gave a slightly different one through Sylph dailies and the complaints were basically gone. Before you go "Well 2.0 players had no opportunity to get the goobue mount.", I still call people out on that. It was a gift for people who stuck around the game in it's worst of times and new players coming in demanding to have it was a middle finger to those who stuck around in 1.0. Compromise was found in giving a goobue with a slightly different look.

Overall point is there are some things people should not be allowed to have unless they put the effort, time, and skill to get it. If you feel entitled to something because people in the past got it under a certain circumstance, well, too bad for you. You want to play the equal opportunity argument. Everyone does have equal opportunity. It is your own schedule, skill, and what you decide to do in the game that decides if you can get the item or not. You are not sinking time into PvP and building up your skills to be the top 100? Ohh still want the Cerberus mount? Well sorry, you can't have it. Not skilled enough to get top 100? Well I am not good at basketball, but i'm not demanding a trophy for being a good sport.

Sorry if I sound off, its late.

[Nezerius]

The Cerberus in concept is not to give incentive to people who may be interested in PvP.

Yeah, right. That's why they ripped the Hellhound (proper name, not the Cerberus) straight out of PvE content, something that PvE players have been seen in countless of Void Ark runs. Something that PvE players have even been requesting as a mount in the game.
If they wanted something purely for PvPers, they'd have designed something new, something completely tied to The Feast.

As a sidenote, it'll be hilarious if the silhouette ends up being a placeholder and the actual mount ends up being completely different.