Making Jobs Rotationally Easier in 4.0

[shao32]

well this is from the last yoshida interview.

Even when you fight alone, there are almost no ocassions where feather foot changes your fate of living or dying. Of course there will be people who say "But i use it when i solo! Don't take away a characteristic from our job", but if we add more actions/abilities, these kinds of actions will get removed from players' hotbars anyway. So we will delete and add new actions instead or leave the name of the action and change what it does to give it more meaning. Another example is the warrior's wrath and abandon stacks where they will both be united to one gauge called "Origin（原初)" (Note: the name of this new stack will be totally different in the En version because most of the names of the warrior moves in the japanese client share the word "origin". For example, inner beast is Soul of the origin(原初の魂）, Raw intuiition is Instinct of the origin (原初の直感) and the LB3 for warrior is Land of the origin(原初の大地) and that's why Yoshida called the new stack for both stances "origin(原初) stacks " ). Warriors will manage this new gauge for both stances and decide what to use each of them on.

On additional skills, there isn't much but considering how tank stances will work with the adjustment that will come in the future. Yoshida is still thinking of how to address the problems of stance switching on additional skills right now. However the adjustments does not influence nor change the battle content itself, as they are created through formula calculations, and other factors. Not all skills from the specific roles itself will be shared as some skills that are job specific only will still exist. (EDIT: The fuck did I misread it as "shaping the outcome of the battle itself...")

complete here: https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...ida_after_nas/

[Lyth]

For reference, the phrase "Additional Skills" is used throughout the text to denote "Cross-Class" skills. This article is a literal translation, so be careful to read everything in context.

[Sarcatica]

The interview pretty much makes it clear that the skill cap should be the same or close to it. So whatever adjustments SE makes, they should fall on somewhat the same page which just screams "git gud" to me, unless if of course they change their minds suddenly.

"-Some of the Devs have suggested a "Hall of the Intermediate" that goes over basic skill rotations and such, fit for people going to EX primals. At first Yoshida was thinking no, because it would be telling players "If you're not good, its bad" but recently he's warmed up to the idea a little bit."

This caught my eye. more "git gud". Overall I would expect more people feeling frustrated and start to get more invested on being better players which is the best scenario IMO.

[Shurrikhan]

snip

Just makes you wonder: why they didn't include Wrath stacks as a Warrior level 30 trait in the first place if they ultimately wanted shared stacks with or without Defiance and without any added identity in the form of a second stance, and why they think it'd simplify anything to call the two stack forms by the same name; if anything it just reduces one indicator of which stack you're in.

Still not sure what influence stance switching would have on additional skills, at least as they are now. What would it matter if you Featherfoot, Awareness, etc., in Deliverance instead of Defiance, directly speaking?

[Shurrikhan]

For you...
In the end, the impact you have is far smaller than the effort you agreed to make.

Isn't that the way tapering skill cap works? As with quality vs. cost, effort tends to increase more exponentially for more linear gains in output.

For better or worse, that's been a targeted design methodology in many a game, right alongside "easy to learn, difficult to master".

[Ultimatecalibur]

Still not sure what influence stance switching would have on additional skills, at least as they are now. What would it matter if you Featherfoot, Awareness, etc., in Deliverance instead of Defiance, directly speaking?

Something that was left out of shao32's quote of the interview is that they are going to add UI elements that make it easier to track various "core" abilities.

The one example was the Monk having 3 orbs somewhere on the screen to represent Greased Lightning. Another was a UI element that would show when Darkside was active.

It is full likely that each tank will have a UI element that tell the player which stance (if any) they are currently in and other UI element actions to help track things like "Origin" (Wrath/Abandon) stacks without having to look at a small buff marker.

[Shurrikhan]

Something that was left out of shao32's quote of the interview is that they are going to add UI elements that make it easier to track various "core" abilities.

The one example was the Monk having 3 orbs somewhere on the screen to represent Greased Lightning. Another was a UI element that would show when Darkside was active.

It is full likely that each tank will have a UI element that tell the player which stance (if any) they are currently in and other UI element actions to help track things like "Origin" (Wrath/Abandon) stacks without having to look at a small buff marker.

That much sounds pretty good, though I'm faintly wary of poor art assets and screen clutter. (No more so than with any added skill and its associated effects, though, of course.)

Off-topic: "Origin"? Really? I mean, at least it's not bastardized German or English this time, but... what is the lore to that? (Yes I saw Shao's post.)

[Ultimatecalibur]

Off-topic: "Origin"? Really? I mean, at least it's not bastardized German or English this time, but... what is the lore to that?

Taken from the reddit post:

Note: the name of this new stack will be totally different in the En version because most of the names of the warrior moves in the japanese client share the word "origin". For example, inner beast is Soul of the origin(原初の魂）, Raw intuiition is Instinct of the origin (原初の直感) and the LB3 for warrior is Land of the origin(原初の大地) and that's why Yoshida called the new stack for both stances "origin(原初) stacks "

[shao32]

well some say they go to remove parry and acc, so unify wrath stacks in to one type looks like they go to to that on parry at least, or make it a stat you alwais have in the gear, the other question about WARs in that change is ¿they go to let WARs do inner beast and steel ciclone out of defiance or its just "meh crit bonus on both stances"?

i just quote the tank references there, the UI elements looks nice, ¿meaby dark flames around my hotbars? i really love that, but i hope in 4.0 whe get a proper darside effect on out fellow dark walkers ;p

pd; the note about the "origin" name is on the quote too, please read carefully ^^

[Sarcatica]

Isn't that the way tapering skill cap works? As with quality vs. cost, effort tends to increase more exponentially for more linear gains in output.

For better or worse, that's been a targeted design methodology in many a game, right alongside "easy to learn, difficult to master".

Not just in many games, it also applies to real life skills. Great surgeon not necessarily have 200% more skill than normal surgeons but the small things add up that distinguish the person to be a great one. Honestly it's the same principle for anything, generally speaking.