Should Cleric Stance be disabled in party instances?

[ty_taurus]

As much as I love it. I wouldn't mind it. The ability appears to cause more harm than good. I'm looking you people who are harassing the healers that don't want to dps.

We talk about it (probably too much) all over the healer board, but in-game, I've never actually seen anyone get harassed for not DPSing.

Usually, when I'm paired with a co-healer that doesn't DPS, it just makes me think "Well now I have to DPS for the both of us." And fair enough, if you're never entering Cleric Stance, then I shouldn't be worried about healing as you'll always be there for the MT to top him off.

[Thunda_Cat_SMASH]

I'm 100% certain there are more people who complain about healers not doing dps than people who complain about healers doing dps.

That's kinda what they said. Most people harass others for not being comfortable with cleric stance and either heckle them until they give up on the role or until they start using it, which causes wipes because they aren't familiar with the tool, which leads to even more harassment.

[Cynfael]

I think it's that players tend to heckle others simply for being bad, and any of the following behaviors can be considered "bad":

- Chronic over/underhealing
- Being passive during healing downtime
- Using CS incorrectly and causing panic and/or death

I don't think that Cleric Stance itself is the issue when it comes to harassment of healers; it's just one of the tools that players can fail to use or use badly. Criticism drawn by playing poorly will persist regardless of CS or no CS.

[DaulBan]

That's kinda what they said. Most people harass others for not being comfortable with cleric stance and either heckle them until they give up on the role or until they start using it, which causes wipes because they aren't familiar with the tool, which leads to even more harassment.

I actually messed up with the sentence there, which is supposed to read 'I'm 100% certain there are more people who complain about people who complain about healers not DPSing than there are actually people who complain about healers not DPSing'.

[Deceptus]

Personally, i think content should scale with group ilvl. The real reason healers dps is that there's just never enough damage going out to heal, save for the hardest content. Dungeon runs will take a bit longer but healers will be healers this way.

Gods no. Then there is NO point in getting stronger.

[Deceptus]

We talk about it (probably too much) all over the healer board, but in-game, I've never actually seen anyone get harassed for not DPSing.
.

If anything, it makes me as a healer want tanks to tank better. If they tank better, I heal less and can DPS more. I had a DRK the other day in Gubal HM whom I told could do larger packs, and didn't do a single Dark Arts-Abyssal Drain Combo. At the end I said it would help him out if on the larger packs to spam them when he was doing Blood Price and he said, "Are you saying I suck?". No, I'm saying you can do better.

When I tank as a DRK, I LOVE being with a WHM who is in sync with me and starts doing Holy when my Blood Price is down. Stuff goes down SO dang quickly.

[Atoli]

until they start using it, which causes wipes because they aren't familiar with the tool

Even more reason to get them used to it, then.
That's like saying it's okay to not call out the DRG for only spamming True Thrust because moving out of AoEs AND using combos is too much for him
Yes, wipes happen, that's part of learning. Eventually they'll get familiar with using it and the wipes won't happen anymore.

Of course there are more people calling out laziness and unwillingness to learn to use your full toolset than people who complain about their healer contributing in any way possible, duh.

[VanilleFang]

The best thing about being a healer is when I get an undergeared tank who takes hits like a wet tissue, and can't hold hate for shit. And the dps, who are pulling the hate are also moths to a flame with them red aoe indicators. Yep, having to clench my butt hole because my teammates are losing HP faster than I can heal them is always fun. /sarcasm

I know a run is going to be a pain in the ass if I can't put on CS or someone will hit the floor. The good/decent runs would be boring if I didn't have CS. Decent runs are more common than bad runs. I'd rather have only bad runs than be stuck with all good runs without CS.

[Masekase_Hurricane]

Even more reason to get them used to it, then.
That's like saying it's okay to not call out the DRG for only spamming True Thrust because moving out of AoEs AND using combos is too much for him
Yes, wipes happen, that's part of learning. Eventually they'll get familiar with using it and the wipes won't happen anymore.

Of course there are more people calling out laziness and unwillingness to learn to use your full toolset than people who complain about their healer contributing in any way possible, duh.

Just let the party know if you screw up due to stance swapping majority will understand. Obviously you don't go practising on some raid run etc.

[Thunda_Cat_SMASH]

The best thing about being a healer is when I get an undergeared tank who takes hits like a wet tissue, and can't hold hate for shit. And the dps, who are pulling the hate are also moths to a flame with them red aoe indicators. Yep, having to clench my butt hole because my teammates are losing HP faster than I can heal them is always fun. /sarcasm

I know a run is going to be a pain in the ass if I can't put on CS or someone will hit the floor. The good/decent runs would be boring if I didn't have CS. Decent runs are more common than bad runs. I'd rather have only bad runs than be stuck with all good runs without CS.

Agreed. These are the fun runs for a healer. It's infinitely more fun than afk cleric stance dpsing.

Just let the party know if you screw up due to stance swapping majority will understand. Obviously you don't go practising on some raid run etc.

And then get accused of trolling and votekicked faster then the inevitable wipe...