Au Ra Origins: The Dawn & Dusk Theory [Spoilers]

[Belhi]

So the Miqo'te are Meracydians that angry Allaghans cross-bred with Ceourls?
"The Allaghans did it" is starting to go too far ;-;

Well the Miqo'te don't seem to be native to Meracydia after all and we know they were persecuted by the Allag who drove them out of Eozrea north rather than south.

As for the Dragon/AuRa theory, I seems to be somewhat solid. Personally though right now I find myself more interested in Voidsent due to what we learned of the Void in 3.4.

[Cilia]

The only thing I can contest is that while the Celestial Wyrms are very powerful, I was not aware they were capable of outright creating sapient races from scratch. Perhaps mutating them a la Ishgardians to a lesser degree, but it cannot be proven one way or another and until this has been done so no, the Celestial Wyrms cannot create sapient races.

Another is that the Au Ra are native to Othard, the Far East, while Meracydia is located to the south of Eorzea. How did they get to Othard from Meracydia, and why has Othard always been called their homeland? What little bit we get from Tiamat does not mention Othard, and we do not have record of any of the Celestial Wyrms being active in that region.

I admit it's quite solid. Got a couple kinks, though. (Is it really that much of a stretch to just believe Au Ra are like they are... because they're Au Ra?)

[Khyzen]

The only thing I can contest is that while the Celestial Wyrms are very powerful, I was not aware they were capable of outright creating sapient races from scratch. Perhaps mutating them a la Ishgardians to a lesser degree, but it cannot be proven one way or another and until this has been done so no, the Celestial Wyrms cannot create sapient races.

Another is that the Au Ra are native to Othard, the Far East, while Meracydia is located to the south of Eorzea. How did they get to Othard from Meracydia, and why has Othard always been called their homeland? What little bit we get from Tiamat does not mention Othard, and we do not have record of any of the Celestial Wyrms being active in that region.

I admit it's quite solid. Got a couple kinks, though. (Is it really that much of a stretch to just believe Au Ra are like they are... because they're Au Ra?)

Agreed, I don't think they created the Au Ra from nothing, I think they're the offspring of a mating between a dragon and either a Hyur, Elezen, Meracydian, or possibly some race we don't know about yet.

As for Othard and Meracydia, as I said in the original post that's probably the strongest argument against this theory and the one that's hard to get around. Just based on that I could be wrong about the whole thing, or we simply haven't been given all the information to connect all the dots yet.

As for the last point, I was content to leave it at Au Ra just being Au Ra as well up until the lore book. But the fact that the Au Ra have the Dawn Father and the Dusk Mother and Bahamut and Tiamat are known as the Dawn Wyrm and the Dusk Wyrm? That just seems way too heavy of a coincidence to ignore. Thus the theorizing!

[Cilia]

We know dragons are capable of reproducing asexually, but there is nothing yet stating they are capable of sexual reproduction. Even if they were, there are certain... problems that would arise from such a relationship with mortals unless said dragon was capable of assuming a humanoid form. While this is a common ability of dragons in fantasy works, none in XIV have displayed this ability as of yet. (I'm going to chalk that "with physical need for a mate" up to a typo; the wording is fishy and sounds like it's meant to say "without physical need for a mate." Of course this does not mean they are incapable of sexual reproduction, but until we know they are... they aren't.)

Coincidental as it may be... sometimes a coincidence is just a coincidence. Sometimes. (I admit it's solid, OK?!)

[princefruit]

I personally love this theory, and I'm grateful you put this together because my Lore book JUST shipped today (so much for paying all that extra for 2 day shipping Q_Q) and I haven't been able to do any Au Ra research itself.

On "The Allagans did it" theory: The Wind-Up Odin flavor text game mentions that Odin's blade came from an Auri warrior. Is there anything in the Lore book about Odin and when he existed compared to when the Allagans were around? How would that help/hurt the gene creation theory? I remember people bringing up Odin to refute the "Au Ra came from Shiva/Hraesvelgr" theory when the Au Ra were first announced, but I honestly don't know much about the Allagan time period or Odin's lore (aside from the Sword bit)

Also we have to keep in mind that the Dawn/Dusk stuff is referred to as "Auri creation myth." The story could very well be false canonically, but believed by many Au Ra through ages of passing the story down. (Similar to real world Creationism theories, many people believe in it and there are different takes based on different religions but there's never been hard proof). Either way I still hope that the theory has truth, it makes the Au Ra really interesting and make sense of their physiology.

[Cilia]

If I recall rightly, Odin originates from a rebel of indeterminate race who took up Zantetsuken to rebel against Allag. He believed he could control the sword, but it ended up sundering (tempering) him and turning him into its first host. There's also something about Urth, a priestess, in there...

The Wind-up Odin minion states that he acquired the blade upon slaying an Auri warrior, which is why it has an Eastern (Japanese) game despite Odin himself being from Northern (Norse) mythology. We know this isn't exactly the case; one can only speculate that Zantetsuken's original host may have been from the North, and the "Odin" name is just passed down from host to host because people don't know any better.

[Ametrine]

If you don't mimd asking, what about the final two of the brood? I thought there was hard confirmation that one of them did opt to settle in Othard.

*still lacks the lore book, herself.

[princefruit]

snip Odin snip

Thank you for the info! I was thinking that maybe if Zantetsuken was an Auri blade it might have hinted that Au Ra were already here when the Allagans were. But if Zantetsuken's first host became the "Odin" we know, it does make little sense that "Odin" took the blade (If I'm understanding it correctly). I mean the flavor text of the Odin minion is myth and legend too, after all. It also doesn't disprove that Au Ra could have been Allagan creations. Thanks again!

[Balipu]

I may have a crazy idea for this question.
How's this version?

Tiamat mated with a mi'qote.
Bahamut got angry and all but killed off the male mi'qote (explaining why there are so few compared to female).
While going about his pogrom, Bahamut noticed that mi'qote girls look kinda nice, so he also tried out mi'qote-dragon sex.
And so Au Ra were born, who were mi'qote with the animal parts switched to dragon parts.
Mi'qote were persecuted in Allag for mating with, what is essentially a power source to them.

As for Zantetsuken, well I think we might have to wait for an Othard expansion for that. But I could see the Au Ra praying for a weapon to stop their enemies (likely Allag again).

[Cilia]

All of the Spoken - Dragon mating speculation fails to answer a very key question:

How would it work? I mean, physically? There is a massive size difference between dragons (esp. Celestial Wyrms) and a Spoken of any race, and dragons in this setting are not known to be able to shapeshift into Spoken. Spoken can become dragonkin, but that is a one-way trip and they're not dragons per sé, just beings who heavily resemble dragons.

As for Zantetsuken's origin, who knows. Maybe it was a primal in the vein of Alexander. It still leaves a pretty big question open though (the "Norse name" vs. "Eastern-named weapon"), one that's not like to be answered any time soon (if ever).