Is The World of Darkness the Void? [3.4 spoilers]

[myahele]

It's been a long time since I've seen the scene. But can anyone explain to me why Nero was turning purple/ partially crystallized when he was in the World of Darkness? What exactly was going on? I know that prolonged exposure turned him into that because he didn't have the covenant protecting him unlike Doga and Une.

[Anonymoose]

But can anyone explain to me why Nero was turning purple / partially crystallized when he was in the World of Darkness? What exactly was going on? I know that prolonged exposure turned him into that because he didn't have the covenant protecting him unlike Doga and Une.

It was a more than just the raw exposure (which is why he went down relatively fast). Nero was fighting to protect Unei and Doga; the covenant protected them from the Cloud of Darkness, but not its minions (always check the technicalities with entities that offer contracts, eh?). His wounds allowed the darkness (lower-case d) to invade his body and begin eroding away at his aether.

[SilverArrow20XX]

Void Theory

The Void is the primordial Chaos from which all originated according to FFV. Like in Greek mythology. I don't think it was created by the 13th reflection being devoured by darkness, but rather it is the origin of darkness and assimilated the 13th reflection back into itself. It is all and the different worlds are merely bubbles that formed within it.

My thoughts are that the Wold of Darkness is just an area at the edge of the Void that is touching Hydaelyn. It is likely that much of what we see there is corrupted distortions of things from the 13th reflection. Just as what we see of the Interdimensional Rift in FFV, the World of Darkness in FFIII, and the Void Beyond in FFXIII are edges of the Void touching those worlds respectively, with structures in the Rift clearly being from FFV's world.

It is likely precisely because a reflection of Hydaelyn has been devoured that the Void is so relatively accessible in FFXIV compared to other FF worlds, as the barriers of the world's "bubble" would be thinner. The 13th reflection would also be the closest section of the Void to Hydaelyn, so that is the area that anyone accessing the Void from Hydaelyn would first encounter. It makes sense that they would think that the 13th reflection is the entirety of the Void if that is all they've ever seen of it.

On the Cloud of Darkness and other Voidsent

In all of her appearances, she appears to have an instinctual desire to return worlds to the Void. In FFIII and XIV, she manipulated Xande into facilitating this (though in XIV, it's Xande who wants her to erase the world, we don't actually hear her side). These worlds were both in states of imbalance at the time. III's with an overabundance of darkness, and XIV's on the cusp of an Umbral Calamity. In FFXI she took advantage of the weakened winds of time to do it (a result of the lack of conflict between light and dark that weakened the protective barrier Vana'diel had to the Void). Time travel in both XI and XIII also seem to weaken the barrier, allowing easier access from the Void by weakening the stability of time itself in the world, something that doesn't exist in the Void, and is a main component in what separates "existence" from the "nonexistence" of the Void. She may be the same entity across the multiverse or not. I doubt we'll ever know for sure, but something similar to her happens whenever a world's integrity is broken in some way.

A similar entity is Necron from FFIX. Another being who decided he should return a world to the Void. He's interesting in that he just observed the world from the outside and came to that conclusion and was open to having his mind changed. Other godlike beings like Shinryu, and creators like Bhunivelze "God of Light" and possibly even the Mothercrystals come to mind as well. It seems odd that beings of light would also be "Voidsent" since we usually think of the Void as Darkness, but it is in actuality the nothingness from which both light and darkness come from and return to.

[Cilia]

The problem with all of that is the cosmology does not have to remain entirely consistent across universes. While it helps as a reference point, when material in that game's universe contradicts pre established franchise cosmology that game's cosmology trumps it. Summons are always good unless they're being used by antagonists in the franchise; here they are always antagonistic (though they do have the potential to be benevolent or at least benign, i.e. Ramuh and Alexander), and as a result of simply manifesting on the material plane kill the planet (meaning even if they were benevolent they can't remain - again, look at the actions of both Ramuh and Alexander).

If you want to get extremely technical and argue semantics, there isn't even a contradiction. "Void" refers to the interstice between universes that can be traversed by characters; "void" refers to the shattered, warped remnants of the Thirteenth Reflection. Beforehand the two were conflated with one another because we didn't know any better. Now we do, and that vagary has been clarified.

... that's not to say the barrier between the Void and Eorzea / Hydaelyn isn't weaker in the void, or that Elidibus & co. weren't lying (by omission) when they told the Warriors of Darkness the void is the remnants of the Thirteenth Reflection, or that a Reflection being drowned in Light or Dark leads to it being lost to the Void, but this is just speculation. The information we have now states the cosmology of Hydaelyn / Eorzea pertinent to this issue as such:

-Light and Dark dwelled as one until Zodiark began to covet power and upset the balance.
-Hydaelyn banished Zodiark, His essence scattered across the Thirteen Reflections of the Source and His corporeal form bound as the moon.
-The point of an Ardor / Calamity is to break down the dimensional barriers separating a Reflection from the Source.
-A Reflection becoming a void of either Light or Dark does not benefit the Ascians.
-The Thirteenth Reflection was drowned in darkness and became what we know as the void.
-The First Reflection is/was (on the verge of being) drowned by light and becoming a different sort of void.

... unless, of course, the World of Darkness actually is in the Void. But we just got some consistency, and I'd like to keep it that way... dammit, more important questions I shoulda asked...

[Anonymoose]

"Void" refers to the interstice between universes that can be traversed by characters; "void" refers to the shattered, warped remnants of the Thirteenth Reflection. Beforehand the two were conflated with one another because we didn't know any better. Now we do, and that vagary has been clarified.

<...> the barrier between the Void and Eorzea <...> that a Reflection being drowned in Light or Dark leads to it being lost to the Void <...> ... unless, of course, the World of Darkness actually is in the Void.

As one would expect given my first impressions, I'm absolutely down with trying to reconcile new revelations with the idea that the void is something more than only what was left in the Thirteenth Reflection's wake. Nigh every entity in the game - mortals, Ascians, voidsent themselves - talks of void and darkness as something that came before. It seems at odds.

However, we cannot neglect that (despite there being a difference between darkness and Darkness) void has never had a capital v in Final Fantasy XIV. Not in 2011, and not now. Similar to how the cloud of darkness is the Cloud of Darkness (by virtue of it being a proper noun), you have things like the Void Ark, Void Call, Void Fire III, Talk to My Voidsent, and High Voidmage Cessair. However, we can't call the vaguery clarified until we have even one example, can we?

Still ... I, too, am theorizing a difference between the [Thirteenth] void and the [opposite of existence] void. I'm just not sure we can confidently call it anything. We can call it capital Void, we can name it for the swirling primordial Chaos, or the infinite darkness beyond the Darkness and the Light, what have you. But the word "hypothetical" belongs prominently before all of them for now, no?

I'm keeping an eye out for concrete hints, but I have a sense that it will be no short observation.

P.S.
I, too, often trip over vagary vs. vaguery, lol. (At least the latter did turn out to be a word, this time...)

[Belhi]

Someone should accost Koji at Fanfest and get an answer out of him:P

[Zohar_Lahar]

If I recall rightly, voidsent are functionally immortal. The best we can do is kill whatever it is they're possessing, banishing them back to the void. Since we fought the Cloud of Darkness in the void (or so close to its penumbra we may as well be in the void), the best we could do is slow it down. We managed to defeat it, but unlike 99% of everything else in this game, not kill it, and being in the void it just got back up for more. Hell, even the Nullstone can't properly kill voidsent, just cancel contracts with (thereby banishing) them!

... I can't recall whether the Cloud is the First Rung, or just one of the First Rung. Scathach hasn't been around for at least fifteen centuries to contest it either way, but we're going to need the Nullstone to banish her.

Can't permanently kill voidsent, only banish back to void. Might be Am probably wrong about that though.

(And it's not the spandex; she's just pretty beautiful. They may yet add Ferdiad, but there's plenty of guys and gals for all tastes. Plus three varieties of Cu Chulainn. Not sure what Scathach will look like here, female voidsent do tend to be a bit more... err... shapely than male varieties but are still monstrous.)

One Guildhest claimed that slain voidsent's aether is incompatible with the Lifestream, but that was used to facilitate the fight gimmick and never is mentioned anywhere else. At the very least, I would assume primals can still drain their aether.

[Alberel]

One Guildhest claimed that slain voidsent's aether is incompatible with the Lifestream, but that was used to facilitate the fight gimmick and never is mentioned anywhere else. At the very least, I would assume primals can still drain their aether.

This does make sense when compared to what Arbert says about his mission though. If the First falls to a void of light then the souls on that world will be unable to return to the lifestream. The entire reason he wants to force a Rejoining to end his world is because that would at least reclaim the aether of the souls from his world before they essentially get 'locked out'.

[Cilia]

Interestingly, voidsent incompatibility with lifestream may explain Midgardsormr immortality.

Both originate from different worlds, are alien. So aether foreign to Hydaelyn, cannot be integrated into lifestream. Can still eat Hydaelyn aether, but own aether is too alien, preventing death.

[SilverArrow20XX]

Wouldn't that also apply to the first brood then since they were birthed as eggs before coming to Hydaelyn, making their core aether alien? Yet the first brood can be killed permanently.