SPOILER WARNING - Sorry SE, you've lost me with the latest story

[Dualgunner]

Honestly, I'm glad the WoD are gone. I never liked them conceptually, I felt they were cheesy antagonists. I was pleased to hear that they actually did have some story and motivation other than "we're obviously the opposite of you," and I liked how the devs used them to bring the concept of parellel worlds into the story. However, they served their purpose and they can go back to where the other cheesy anti-heroes go when the plot device is over.

While I personally disagree that the concept of having our equal/opposite as an enemy is a cheesy one, I can see that it is a trope that is well and in some cases over used. If done right it can be a great introspective into who we are as a hero, especially when faced with a parallel version of ourselves who lived their life differently, albeit similarly. I feel like they shouldn't have been tossed aside quite so quickly, but I'll agree to disagree with you on cheesiness of the concept :3

That said, can we talk about Nero? Am I the only one who's convinced he's found the OMEGA that was discussed in the 2.x series. If you look at his surroundings, he's very near the place where the level 60 (or maybe 58, can't remember) SMN job quest took place, which IIRC is at Cartenau, which is where OMEGA was and then Nero shows up all like "look at meh new toy," now THAT is a development I am interested in!

Oh damn, I completely forgot all about Omega! That'll be a cool arc.

[Ametrine]

Kinda sad they threw Nero's character development in the Crystal Tower saga out the window though.

Are we sure that this is the case, though?

I only remember him giving up on Crystal Tower and moving past his rivalry with Cid, not him turning over a new leaf....

Mental note: Need to rewatch Crystal Tower cutscenes again.

[Kaurie]

That's really up to personal preference. Everything we're arguing here is subjective, but it doesn't hurt to share opinions and viewpoints so long as we keep them in perspective.

Obviously, and that is all I was doing, sharing my opinion xD

[Zojha]

Yet how is that any different to the simple fact that the Warrior of Light shows the same inclinations during the DRK quest chain and literally goes across Eorzea slaying people for coin in addition to saving people from Primals?

Heh. I dunno, but the entire DRK questline Fray is like:"Come on, let us be selfish for once and not give a damn about other people..." and you are like:"Nope, we gonna help dem peeps and we're not gonna ask for payment either." "You gotta be kidding, people don't even thank you for it. Seriously?!" "Ya, seriously. It's what we do, so shaddap!" Several times, we show distaste for what Fray does and says and in the end, we subdue them, even though they have become so powerful as to manifest. That is how powerful the selflessness of the WoL is.

I don't think a WoD would be capable of such. All over the job questlines, the WoL is portrayed as someone who is motivated by the desire to protect and help people and this is precisely what allows them to easily tame their inner beast or draw forth the power of bard songs. It honestly seems more like a mother child relationship - yes, you love the child but when it regularly wakes you up at 2 AM for no reason at all only to vomit on you when you really just wanted to finally have a few hours of sleep because you're tired, exhausted and your back hurts...the desire to shake it and shout comes up. You don't act on it, but gods be damned if you aren't annoyed by it.

[Dualgunner]

I interpret the DRK questline very differently. Fray saying "Come on let's be selfish" is the WoL's true, unrefined desire--and when we resist the id with the ego, Fray begins showing WoL just how thankless and just how pathetic and selfish some of the people he/she ends up helping are. This works, to the point where Fray had the WoL completely convinced, and ready to "go to a land far away" (a metaphor for suicide? possibly) until their friends and people who were grateful began reminding them exactly why they help people.

[KaitlanKela]

Are we sure that this is the case, though?

I only remember him giving up on Crystal Tower and moving past his rivalry with Cid, not him turning over a new leaf....

Mental note: Need to rewatch Crystal Tower cutscenes again.

I played this story recently (recent sub, I'm behind) and I agree with this reading. He got over some personal issues, but at the end he definitely was looking for some new Allagan thing to get his hands on. He's definitely not over that at least