SE must be drunk.

[SpookyGhost]

Like I said, BiS is likely still going to be savage/tome upgraded gear, but whether or not the stats are actually favorable is a different question that depends on what they do with Parry. You're right that the gear players go into 4.0 with won't really matter, because you can clear everything with just standard gear. That same fact, though, is also what also allows for the possibility of tanks ignoring parry. There's a lot of weekend tanks out there who will only have 24-man gear. I don't think anyone is going to complain about that, given that the content will be equally clear-able with both 260 and 270 sets.

I don't think that Parry will be required to clear the starting dungeons in 4.0 or anything, but they're throwing Parry at us now so that we have access to that gear when 4.0 has launched.

That actually depends on the content you're running. If we're talking about standard end-game PvE content, then yes. The gear with the highest item level is the king. However, if we're talking about content that is level sync'd then the answer changes a bit.

No, it doesn't, because secondary stats don't matter outside of something like min ilvl raiding which isn't going to be something most people do. You're not going to min/max your secondaries for Sastasha NM.

however, if you've ever walked into a match of PvP

It's exactly the same as PVE, except Accuracy disappears. Also I have no idea what kind of argument you're trying to make here. "But PvP!"... and? Like we're not talking about PvP, we're talking about PvE when 4.0 launches wherein you'll want to use the highest ilvl stuff because it is unequivocally better. If you're stuck with i260 stuff because you just showed up last minute or whatever then okay, that's the highest ilvl stuff you have so you use that. But if you had the choice to use the ilvl 270 stuff you would. You wouldn't go "well this has this and that, so I'm going to give up health for the extra whatever". As a DPS, sure, it's not as important, I remember BRDs prioritizing lower ilvl pieces with higher Crit due to how BL procs worked back in 2.0 - but giving up health, physical defense, and magic defense for a small amount of extra crit is madness. Right side is more understandable since it's just health, but the trade would have to be severely in favor of the DPS or very minimal on the health, otherwise you're still looking at a worse piece.

[Februs]

I don't think that Parry will be required to clear the starting dungeons in 4.0 or anything, but they're throwing Parry at us now so that we have access to that gear when 4.0 has launched.

I'm not trying to argue with you here. I already agreed (twice) that BiS will undoubtedly be the highest item level gear, regardless of how terrible those stats are. I'm just pointing out that no one is going to discriminate against any tank who happens to be using non-parry loaded gear, even if it's a lower item level, because it really won't make a difference. This is especially the case in 4.0, because we'll be leaving our 3.5 gear behind us within a day of launch, replacing it with practically anything else we pick up in the very first new dungeon.

No, it doesn't, because secondary stats don't matter outside of something like min ilvl raiding which isn't going to be something most people do. You're not going to min/max your secondaries for Sastasha NM.

I did specify PvP for a reason. I'm aware that no one in their right mind is going to min/max their gear for standard lower level sync content, although the concept of min ilvl raiding is an interesting one. That didn't even cross my mind, but it would be enjoyable, assuming you could find seven other players who are willing to pick up the challenge.

It's exactly the same as PVE, except Accuracy disappears.

I'm sorry, Spook, but you're way off the mark on this one. It is most certainly not the same in PvP, and the difference has been well documented over in the PvP forums. I'm not going to bother with specifics here, because this isn't the place for it, but min/maxing your gear the only way to make the best of your stat caps in that content. Just because you don't have an interest in that, does not mean that the interest does not exist for anyone. It's not as though PvE content has a heavier merit over that interest, either, because you could literally go into ANY PvE content in the game (aside from maybe savage level) with the minimum required item level and still clear it as a tank. No one would even bat an eyelash at your item level, so long as you preform your job.

That aside, I'm not really sure what you're trying to argue here. For one, I wasn't trying to start an argument in the first place, and I was actually agreeing with you from the start about BiS gear. As for 4.0 PvE content ... so what? You are arguing the merits of secondary stats on gear that will literally be replaced the very moment that content is released. No one cares what gear you'll be wearing in 4.0, or what secondaries it has, because you'll be out of that gear as soon as you hit the first dungeon of that content. It's like arguing the merits of having your junker car tuned up and cleaned before you trade up to the next model. By comparison, anyone concerned with minimum ilvl raiding or PvP stat caps makes more sense, as their caps will remain consistent regardless of new content.

Again, you're completely right that BiS is without a doubt the highest ilvl set available when it comes to PvE content, and most of you will only ever be concerned with that content. I'm not arguing that point, but what's BiS is not the be-all-end-all of this topic. As things stand right now, Parry is still a throw-away stat and considered universally unfavorable in ALL content of the game, regardless of if it happens to be on a BiS piece or not. Further, that BiS gear means absolutely nothing in 4.0, as it will not be required to clear any of the intro content and will be replaced by that content on day 1 of its release.

[Bloodklat]

Thanks for screwing us over on this patch SE. I just returned from a long break, excited about the new stuff only to find out SE has ruined tanks on this patch. Good bye again game. Break until 4.0.

[Zojha]

How do they decide stats for gear exactly? They know people hate parry and will avoid it at all costs so why make gear with so much parry?!.

It seems really arbitrary to be honest.

I personally avoid skill speed as much as parry on my Monk and Ninja since I'm already suffering from lag and skill speed just exacerbates the problem, but SE keeps throwing the stuff at me ._.'

Heh. Kinda makes you wish for a relic-armor you could individualize >.>

[Kaisinel]

If you don't want parry gear then raid? Problem solved. Most of the actual good gear for every job is from the raid because the raid scene was crippled with previous savage.

[Maero]

The thing is though,
other jobs have not so great stats on gear as well.
Not only tanks
Parry i imagine will be of more use at some point

[HaelseMikiro]

Parry on Scripture gear is probably another method SE is using to 'nudge' players into raiding.

[Zojha]

Parry on Scripture gear is probably another method SE is using to 'nudge' players into raiding.

About as effective as spitting into your guests soup to nudge them to order a steak instead.

[Kiteless]

Parry on Scripture gear is probably another method SE is using to 'nudge' players into raiding.

That would work if parry was at least useful for providing valued defensive utility at the cost of offensive prowess. It would make it the sort of gear that would be useful in progression, sacrificing DPS and clear times for the sake of survivability, encouraging players to use it as a stepping stone towards a more offensive gearset that would take advantage of a player's developed understanding of the nuance and challenges presented by a given raid situation. However, parry doesn't do that. Parry actually ends up doing next to nothing, making it not a stepping stone, but a waste of space. Instead of giving players a tool to work themselves up towards raiding, it gives them crap and tells them to simply deal with it.

[Kaisinel]

More than likely it's only there for casual players who aren't going to raid and have them set up for 4.0 since it's been talked about reworking the parry formula. Only logical reasoning behind it. If you want the BiS gear then you are going to have to raid. Alexander isnt that difficult.