In 4.0 can we please get rid of caster bars on physical ranged jobs?!

[Cinno]

People are still griping about Wanderer's Minuet? Jesus Christ, what is this 3.0?

People will complain about it until the day it gets removed..

They took a class that specialized in mobility, and forced it to stand still. If people wanted to stand still, they have BLM, and SMN. You cant take a class that people have picked, and have played for fifty levels, and change up the formula on them so drastically. It's not even the fact that people dont want to adapt, its that people picked a class and put large amounts of time into it, and suddenly its something entirely different that they didn't choose, and may not even like.

[LaylaTsarra]

People will complain about it until the day it gets removed..

They took a class that specialized in mobility, and forced it to stand still. If people wanted to stand still, they have BLM, and SMN. You cant take a class that people have picked, and have played for fifty levels, and change up the formula on them so drastically. It's not even the fact that people dont want to adapt, its that people picked a class and put large amounts of time into it, and suddenly its something entirely different that they didn't choose, and may not even like.

It's not going to be removed. I actually like them when I bard. I don't find it an issue at all.

[Leigaon]

They took a class that specialized in mobility, and forced it to stand still. If people wanted to stand still, they have BLM, and SMN. You cant take a class that people have picked, and have played for fifty levels, and change up the formula on them so drastically. It's not even the fact that people dont want to adapt, its that people picked a class and put large amounts of time into it, and suddenly its something entirely different that they didn't choose, and may not even like.

Would you be okay with obtaining mobility back including taking back the damage boost WM gave and possibly better party support to make up for what you might lack? I always felt it was the way it was introduced. To sing an enhancement to your arrow or to stay longer to get a better shot, then again maybe now it makes no difference.

Here's my question; have you level 60 bards and machinists consistently done worse than casters in level 60 content since the addition of a half-second cast bar? Are you taking more damage while causing less?

Same, I use my SMN just fine. Now I will admit I do not do savage so maybe these are where the complaints are coming from? I did take BRD to 60 to see how it was, played in a few trials and such. I noticed I moved a lot prior to WM because I could, not because I had to. I will admit missing bloodletter proc was annoying. That would be my only complaint. I switched back to SMN because, I feel I do good support there with a properly timed Virus or E4E

Not canceling, but shooting earlier. Make the shoot weaker and increase the chance to miss

How about we just make it a charged shot? So the longer you hold the shot (basting bar) the more powerful the attack (up to a point). So a hasty shot does a fraction of the damage, but a full draw (on a bow for example) produces a more powerful shot.

Someone mentioned this on another thread about this. This sounds like a decent mid-way point. If you interrupt your aim by having to move it still fires just at lesser damage, but more than it would without WM on.

[Shurrikhan]

People will complain about it until the day it gets removed..

They took a class that specialized in mobility, and forced it to stand still. If people wanted to stand still, they have BLM, and SMN. You cant take a class that people have picked, and have played for fifty levels, and change up the formula on them so drastically. It's not even the fact that people dont want to adapt, its that people picked a class and put large amounts of time into it, and suddenly its something entirely different that they didn't choose, and may not even like.

They forced it to stutter step, much more easily than any true caster, and prep or compromise (again, at less cost than for a true caster) for mobile dps. It's about as rooted as a melee maintaining uptime on a mid-sized mob with some tank-waggle.

The only real sad thing is that Bards fell well behind MCH in terms of preparation for movement possible, by the simple fact that stance-dancing is more costly due to Bloodletter's massive potency and chance frequency and that you have only one instant proc weaponskill instead of two. They gave us a challenge, but then gave us only one real option by which to reliably deal with it — Feint.

As for the issue of how sudden the change was, or even that it's usually a dps loss until 56, I'll agree completely. But I don't think SE should therefore just scrap the mechanic completely. Instead, they should introduce it bit by bit, starting early, until both ends of stance-dancing seems satisfying and rewarding to master — which requires that there are those several little steps or tricks to get used to or keep in mind within a given fight that skill gap will show within, not highly as to make playing in either stance more than one optimally should a noticeable difference in casual content, but enough nonetheless to make a Bard feel like they need to know what they're doing to master it. WM at least has increased that skill gap, and the number of concerns and decisions involved in BRD play. I'd be more likely to quit the class for having lost those than its "mobility" before.

I'm honestly still shocked they went with standing totally still. I'm surprised it wasn't made as long as mage cast time, but you had walking speed movement. Like that just fits with the motif they setup for ranged physical before it felt.

If you could move the whole time at 2/3s speed, or 2/3s of the time (starting movement at about 2/3s cast bar, just short of cast cancel) at 100% speed, the only difference is the latter can be more easily cut in case of emergency, and allows you to more... explosively play chicken with AoEs. There's no difference in actual mobility between your 'archer's walk' and WM. WM's just safer, mechanically.