I think MSQ Roulette does more harm than good, but how could it be improved?

[Blanchimont]

This problem will exist as long as you tie the main story to content unlock. Far too much of the game is gated behind having to complete story quests and it is a massive burden for new players to have to complete what is now around 400 story quests just so they can gain access to end game raids. If you were a long time player, then it is not much of a problem, but new players encounter numerous different problems. The inability to find a dungeon queue even through duty finder is a big problem. I remember one instance where I had to wait nearly 40 minutes just to get one of the trials to pop as a DPS only to end with it failing and having to wait again. This is a terrible experience for new players.

I think a solution is to eliminate the two level 50 stages and divide them up in order to split up the cutscenes as well. Have them be set up as Trials instead of dungeons and combine the Main Scenario roulette with the trials. Castrum should have part 1 up to The Black Eft. From there, the second part goes up to the defeat of the Magitek Colossus and have the third part just fighting the two phases of Livia.

The same thing goes for the Praetorium. Turn it into a trial with three parts. Part 1 is to beat the Magitek Colossus. Part 2 is to board the Magitek armor and end with the defeat of Gaius. Part 3 should be the fight with the Ultima Weapon. Part 4 should be just the Lahabrea fight.

[Nicobo]

Why MSQ Roulette does more harm than good? I disagree. But I don't object if you said those mentors were disqualified.


In 2.0, no roulette no PF, I queued over 4hours for each MSQ, I was queueing as a healer which had very much faster queue than a DPS at that time.

MSQ fixed this issue. Long queue time kill the new players, they will tell others this game just bad due to dead contents.
For players not very nice or not nice, everyone should have seen more than enough before they reached Lv50 ^^;

[Joe_Schmoe]

I think MSQ Roulette does more harm than good, but how could it be improved?

Set the ilvl sync at i90, and not just "Level 50". Because at level 50, you can carry gear as high as i130, which doesn't help matters any. But at ilvl 90, you can still clear content fairly quick (they're centered around i45 gear levels I think), but not so much that it can be cleared with 1-2 guys with everyone else just there for moral support. Everyone would have to contribute.

[Eorzean_username]

Why MSQ Roulette does more harm than good? I disagree.

I understand what you mean, which is why in my OP I did argue that simply removing the Roulette would be a step backwards.

It's not the existence of the Roulette I see as harmful (we need incentives to keep older content flowing for newer players), but something about the implementation is wrong given how much trauma it causes a lot of the Sprouts that I see get dragged through the two dungeons by their hair.

I can't comment on everyone's pre-L50 experiences, but both while I was leveling, and when I do Leveling Roulette each day, I don't witness this sort of issue in pre-L50 MSQ dungeons (Sastasha, Tam-Tara, Copperbell, Ifrit, Toto-Rak, Haukke, Brayflox, Titan, Stone Vigil, Garuda). That's why the two MSQ dungeons were such a jarring experience for me (and many other Sprouts, from what I witness semi-daily).

I remember one instance where I had to wait nearly 40 minutes just to get one of the trials to pop as a DPS only to end with it failing and having to wait again. This is a terrible experience for new players.

I have to admit ignorance about these specific issues (queue times), due to maining and leveling as a Tank job.

Again though, maybe I was lucky, or it's just my datacenter, or...? But despite being a newbie Tank asking for fight instructions and watching cutscenes, in L15-49 content I wasn't rushed or harassed at all. Not even once. Then the MSQ reached L50 and — ouch.

[One-Punch]

I had a similar experience recently on my first time through these dungeons... But it was nothing compared to the nightmare 100 quest chain that followed.

[RikiaReborn]

I would think making the main quests a 4 man instead of 8 man may solve the issue. With only 4, missing one person would potentially make progression harder. As a compensation could up the reward when completing for those who have joined for Exp/Token/cash. Balancing could take a little time. I don't know priority wise, some say its just old content. But as #14 stated, for new players its new and a very important content.

[SenorPatty]

Oh my...this thread has reopened some old wounds lol. I remembered my first time there, about almost two months ago on my SMN. I tried watching the cutscenes but after the first two-to which I noticed I was left behind-that I decided to skip the cutscenes. I remember this second to last cutscene I tried to watch because I was on my lonesome and apparently, I was holding back some people because the boss fight would not start without me getting to that boss zone.

Suffice to say, I think SE needs to revisit this. Maybe create a special 1-player mode for first timers that is heavily nerfed and provides no exp or gear. This would allow newbies to enjoy the story without hindering anyone. Then, after its cleared once, they can participate in regular MSQ roulette with a no cutscene feature.

[Eorzean_username]

I would think making the main quests a 4 man instead of 8 man may solve the issue. With only 4, missing one person would potentially make progression harder. As a compensation could up the reward when completing for those who have joined for Exp/Token/cash. Balancing could take a little time. I don't know priority wise, some say its just old content. But as #14 stated, for new players its new and a very important content.

This would also allow Meridianum and Praetorium to just go into Level 50 Roulette like the later 2.x MSQ dungeons, obviating the need for MSQ Roulette completely.

I think this is actually a promising idea. The fights can already be completed with only 4 players, I don't think it even requires re-tuning (and definitely not a revamp of the whole instance, or anything close).

And it would reduce the mob mentality that 8 players seems to trigger.

[Blanchimont]

I have to admit ignorance about these specific issues (queue times), due to maining and leveling as a Tank job.

Again though, maybe I was lucky, or it's just my datacenter, or...? But despite being a newbie Tank asking for fight instructions and watching cutscenes, in L15-49 content I wasn't rushed or harassed at all. Not even once. Then the MSQ reached L50 and — ouch.

Leveling as a tank makes it far easier. I did levels 52 to 60 on my Paladin about two weeks ago. Queue times were extremely short and you could almost always find a party for everything. It is also much easier to dictate the pace of the fight as well since others have to position around you, the tank. This is not the case for DPS classes. They have extremely long queues. Whatever your tank class has to queue for, expect a DPS class to have to queue for at least 5 times longer. I do occasionally find a few people that have no idea what they are doing and leading to wipes, but it isn't as bad as pre-expansion.