My take on Samurai as a tank

[Khalithar]

I feel like everyone who mentions BST for a tank never actually thinks about the full rammifications of such a job.

For argument's sake let's just pretend they did implement beastmaster as a tank, bear with me. In all likelihood, the pet would just be there as a way to supplement it's DPS. Remember, pets in this game only function as a glorified DoT. As far as AI, they would have to make it like hunter pets in WoW where it automatically goes behind the enemy it's fighting. If anything, the pet might also be included in it's cooldowns, think Fight or Flight style, "beastmaster and pet gain X% damage for Y seconds" or "beastmaster and pet take X% reduced damage for Y seconds." So a tank with a pet might not have a move like scourge/goring blade/fracture and have the pet function as the DoT or apply it.

[ArikDimas]

Shippuu, just out of curiosity, do you know at what stage of development they changed from having Samurai be the Heavensward tank to Dark Knight being the tank? If it was early enough in the development cycle, before actually working on in game assets for the job, it could be possible that when they made the switch they just gave Samurais skill set to Dark Knight.

[Cakekizyy]

Chances are it will be a DPS. It could easily go the other way. He had a hard time deciding to let DRK or SAM be the next tank but ultimately pick DRK. Logic says he would give SAM the DPS role, but who knows truly how SE thinks over there.

We had all three roles witgh HW. So why would DRK make SAM more likely DPS?

[FallenArisen0990]

Text

Look, Im glad you think SAM should be a tank but it's not going to be. Yoshi-P is hell bend on making it a DPS. They are gonna make it use the same gear as DRG because NIN shares MNK gear pre-2.4. We already establish SAMs don't always wear Heavy Armor. /end rant.

[Velhart]

We had all three roles witgh HW. So why would DRK make SAM more likely DPS?

Because the debate Yoshi-P mentioned was not just 2 possible tanks. He also debated if both DRK or SAM should be DPS instead of tank. Has also mentioned he could not decide if SAM should be DPS or tank. So there were more factors than which should tank.

[Cakekizyy]

Thanks for info.

[Derio]

Ultimately Yoshi said he didnt want the queue for players to increase like ninja did. Everyone knew that when ninja was released the queue times went through the roof. So I think if Samurai is a dps. Then the healer and tank jobs for 4.0 must be equally or more desireable than SAM

[MagiusNecros]

He couldn't decide between DPS or Tank for Samurai. Clearly the only clear avenue is OT where it can be both.

[Shippuu]

For argument's sake let's just pretend they did implement beastmaster as a tank, bear with me. In all likelihood, the pet would just be there as a way to supplement it's DPS. Remember, pets in this game only function as a glorified DoT. As far as AI, they would have to make it like hunter pets in WoW where it automatically goes behind the enemy it's fighting. If anything, the pet might also be included in it's cooldowns, think Fight or Flight style, "beastmaster and pet gain X% damage for Y seconds" or "beastmaster and pet take X% reduced damage for Y seconds." So a tank with a pet might not have a move like scourge/goring blade/fracture and have the pet function as the DoT or apply it.

The problems here, are once again it's a tank that is technically 2 targets to heal. It's already unwieldly trying to heal SMN and MCH pets as they don't show on the party bar for anyone except the owner. Secondly, if the pet is automatically behind the target, then it's going to get hit with all the mechanics that melee DPS normally have to dodge, meaning the tank player has to not only deal with his own tank mechanics, but also micro his pet to dodge all the melee mechanics as well.

These can be solved by things like, all their pets are ranged and thus no real different from turrets/garuda egis. Or that their pets are very very expendable, and they're basically brought out just to die shortly afterwards. With a low cooldown like MCH have with their turrets it's possible, but in the end is this fun at all? To constantly be expending pets and resummoning them over and over? All so that your character deals less damage than other tanks because some of your DPS is dragged to your pet.

It could work sure but it comes with a laundry list of issues that have to be solved.

Shippuu, just out of curiosity, do you know at what stage of development they changed from having Samurai be the Heavensward tank to Dark Knight being the tank? If it was early enough in the development cycle, before actually working on in game assets for the job, it could be possible that when they made the switch they just gave Samurais skill set to Dark Knight.

They've not said much about the timeframe of ultimately when it was decided that DRK would be the tank over SAM for Heavensward and so we have no information on if they had developed abilities or animations for SAM that they repurposed for DRK. Animations are less likely as they are likely created later in the development process of a job, but certainly some of the DRK skills could have originally been meant for SAM.

It doesn't really change much though if they did, it just means they have to develop new abilities like they would if they go with a tank that isn't SAM. A new tank can still have parry mechanics even if DRK and WAR have parry mechanics, just like a new tank can have flat damage reduction cooldowns just like the other tanks have.

Look, Im glad you think SAM should be a tank but it's not going to be. Yoshi-P is hell bend on making it a DPS. They are gonna make it use the same gear as DRG because NIN shares MNK gear pre-2.4. We already establish SAMs don't always wear Heavy Armor. /end rant.

The only things we've established is how deliberately obtuse you are and how wrong you are about pretty much everything you've said here.

[EdwinLi]

Ultimately Yoshi said he didnt want the queue for players to increase like ninja did. Everyone knew that when ninja was released the queue times went through the roof. So I think if Samurai is a dps. Then the healer and tank jobs for 4.0 must be equally or more desireable than SAM

Here is a better idea!

Make SAM a Tank Job and Red Mage the Healer Job

Then release Gunblade Job as the DPS Job for 4.0

That way Tank players get their SAM counter/parry/what ever tank

Healers finally get a Healer Job that doesn't require them to stop healing just to DPS with Red Mage Healing Mechanic allow them to cause damage to all nearby enemies to their Healed ally in Black magic stance and White Magic Stance gives them a 50% chance to dualcast their Healing Skill. Thus Red Mage introduce a new mechanic of a Berserker/Burst Healer which can heal and cause damage to enemies at the same time.

and DPS get the greatly desired Gunblade Job people been praying for years which can fit into Ala Mhigo as the place has been Garleanized with garlean technology due to being turned into a Garlean Fortress City.