Patch 3.3 (Trailer) Discussion (2.x - 3.2 Spoilers)

[Morningstar1337]

I must be the only one that has no strong attachments to any of the villains in this game. I'm the kind of guy that prefers the bad guys to stay down and stay there instead of coming back because lol reasons *looks at Sephiroth and Sin from the audio drama*

I blame Draco In Leather Pants for that

[Yasuhiro]

I blame Draco In Leather Pants for that

That image with the caption is funny, reminds me of how people think Cloud is emo in FFVII and I say "did we play the same game!?"

[CyrilLucifer]

I blame Draco In Leather Pants for that

That's really not my case. I mean, you can't even do that with Lahabrea. You might be able to make this argument in an expansion or two if we're shown more of a grey side of things in the Zodiark/Hydaelyn conflict, though.
My issue is that I really am not fond of the protagonists in this game. Ysayle and Estinien were the only HW primaries I actually enjoyed; the Scions are basically just blah to me and Krile and Yugiri definitely aren't really helping on that front. I adored Moenbryda, but, er, yeah. Middy would have made an incredibly interesting addition to 3.0 if he had more than 5 lines over 3 scenes.

Now Lahabrea? He's fun. And is an interesting case where the villain learns from his mistakes and corrects them throughout the course of 2.X (thanks for mucking that up, Igeyorhm; you should have killed the WoL when you had the chance. Also, stop being impatient and put that crystal away, that's not a good -). Plus, I'm not going to lie, his little impatient whining with his arms across the chest at the end of 2.0 was adorable. I'm not even going to try to defend my reasoning there.
Elidibus? Super interesting. Incredibly so. Do I need to explain why? I don't think this needs an explanation.

Nero, too, is wonderful. I'm not sure if I need to explain this, either, but I appreciate the greyness of his character and his changes over time.

I don't necessarily like Thordan, but I find him more interesting than Aymeric just about every day of the week. The same can be said of Gaius.

Unrelated, but I can't for the life of me remember that female sky pirate antagonist's name off the top of my head. So it's not like I just enjoy villains for the sake of being villains.

[Frederick22]

Now Lahabrea? He's fun. And is an interesting case where the villain learns from his mistakes and corrects them throughout the course of 2.X (thanks for mucking that up, Igeyorhm; you should have killed the WoL when you had the chance. Also, stop being impatient and put that crystal away, that's not a good -). Plus, I'm not going to lie, his little impatient whining with his arms across the chest at the end of 2.0 was adorable. I'm not even going to try to defend my reasoning there.
Elidibus? Super interesting. Incredibly so. Do I need to explain why? I don't think this needs an explanation.

Really? Lahabrea did not learn from his mistakes, and thats was his doom at the end. I thought that was very clear.
His way of thought was that if you can beat someone with an stick, use a bigger stick instead and that didnt help him at all.

I only agree about Edibudus. He sees all with a different perspective and he does his moves carefully. But he still thinks that he hasalready the fight won.

[CyrilLucifer]

Frederick, I went over how Lahabrea learned from his mistakes in a thread about 3 months ago when you said exactly that same thing.

It's actually Igeyorhm that makes the mistakes in HW - Lahabrea is very precise and much more controlled in his behavior in 3.0 than he is in 2.0. The one time before the ARF that he actively interferes with you is the Vault - and by all rights, he would have succeeded had the WoL not had plot armor. Play through 2.0 and 3.0 again and you'll see how differently he acts regarding you.

Also keep in mind that 2.X is basically all about Lahabrea succeeding. Those Extreme Primals? He gets exactly what he wants from you with them. Primal Pet Project (the one two triggered the idea for which is very likely the WoL)? Completely successful - on two occasions!

Quoting myself from the last time you said this.

You're conflating underestimating a foe with not learning. It's not on him that our Blessing became a Super Blessing in 3.0 (possibly from Minfilia's sacrifice) paired with us becoming stronger as well. If anything, he didn't underestimate us in the ARF, hence why he has Igeyorhm with him in order to counter our strength, since it was clear that one Ascian is not enough to take us down. He was definitely more prepared that time. If anything, it was Igeyorhm who underestimated us. Twice. Once after Bismarck, thinking we wouldn't get the Blessing back and that we weren't a threat. The second time was in the ARF when she popped out her dark crystal early.

If it had been Lahabrea with Thordan after Bismarck, we probably wouldn't have survived the encounter. He wanted us dead; Igeyorhm seemed to just want to do her duty (also shown in their pre-battle dialogue in the ARF to further the evidence for this).

He did learn, precisely for the reasons I stated. He started taking advantage of the Echo in mortals (Ysayle/Shiva), when earlier he was basically just tossing its mortal usage away as weak. He found mortal use of the Echo useless until we beat him out of Thancred with it.

Lahabrea underestimating us would have been him coming alone to the ARF, thinking he could defeat us that way. Not learning would have been him continuing to view mortal potential with Echo as worthless. He does neither of these things.

So I'm not sure how you can say all he does is get a bigger stick. He changes his strategy entirely.

[Frederick22]

Quoting myself from the last time you said this.

You're conflating underestimating a foe with not learning. It's not on him that our Blessing became a Super Blessing in 3.0 (possibly from Minfilia's sacrifice) paired with us becoming stronger as well. If anything, he didn't underestimate us in the ARF, hence why he has Igeyorhm with him in order to counter our strength, since it was clear that one Ascian is not enough to take us down. He was definitely more prepared that time. If anything, it was Igeyorhm who underestimated us. Twice. Once after Bismarck, thinking we wouldn't get the Blessing back and that we weren't a threat. The second time was in the ARF when she popped out her dark crystal early.

If it had been Lahabrea with Thordan after Bismarck, we probably wouldn't have survived the encounter. He wanted us dead; Igeyorhm seemed to just want to do her duty (also shown in their pre-battle dialogue in the ARF to further the evidence for this).

He did learn, precisely for the reasons I stated. He started taking advantage of the Echo in mortals, when earlier he was basically just tossing its mortal usage away as weak. He found mortal use of the Echo useless until we beat him out of Thancred with it.

Lahabrea underestimating us would have been him coming alone to the ARF, thinking he could defeat us that way. Not learning would have been him continuing to view mortal potential with Echo as worthless. He does neither of these things.

It seems he tried, but still he failed big beacuse of more or less the same reasons. He didnt thought we would become so strong in such a short time.
Wasnt his "girlfriend"'s fault, he would have made the same thing on her case. He planed that Thordan would kill us for kim.

Not learling and understumating is more or less the same thing. He fail for undertime the Wol, and hen failed again beacuse of it.